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straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Platypus Farm posted:

This game is confusing the poo poo out of me. It seems absolutely terrible and derivative and awful. I'm about level 10 or 11 and I haven't seen a quest that wasn't horrible.

At the same time, I REALLY want to like it because of the art style and animation.

I have a tremendous tolerance for holy trinity MMOs (in fact I prefer them) but I cannot figure out what the hell this game wants to be.

Yeah, I made a medic settler and played the tutorial until it crashed my machine at level 2. I'm already getting bored of searching for clickables in the world. It seems like the combat will be great and the whole settler/player building concept looks cool. It feels like they're rubbing my nose in their cute steampunk art and lore, instead of letting me just explore it.

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straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."
Do settlers eventually make permanent buildings? I'm less excited about Settler if it's mostly non-permanent stuff, although I just built a shield booster and watched... now five pubbies run by and use it, which is gratifying.

The color scheme, the endless NPC prattle, the questionable UI... this is Star Wars Galaxies 11th Anniversary Edition.

e: oh - what's the point of the broken banners and torches and so on - the "repairable" settler buildings?

straw man fucked around with this message at 02:17 on May 10, 2014

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Enos Shenk posted:

I'm in the "I really want to like this" boat as well. I love the art style and the animations and all the life they've put into the areas. I enjoy the combat too, but...

It really does feel like how SWG did to me. They spent so much time trying to follow a years out-of-date formula and didn't pay attention to any modern MMO systems. I'm pretty sure GW2 ruined me, because having to wait for a quest mob to spawn so you get your turn at killing it is just laughable in 2014.

I notice there's inconsistencies about that though. Some quests I did and I saw other people doing the same thing obviously in their own "instance" of the quest. Then some you get the problem with waiting your turn to kill something.

I think I just don't have the patience anymore for the old style slow levelling slow getting around game. If this was a F2P game I'd definately pick it up and play it for a bit. But for full price and a monthly fee? That poo poo is crazy talk.

They probably paid some attention to GW2 - the double-tap dodge feels like it was taken straight from GW2 but with WoW-style skill charges. Which sounds like a grand idea, except both games' dodge mechanisms feel anemic as gently caress after playing a monk in WoW.

I think it would be a major improvement to cut the entire tutorial zone and start new players at the crashed dropship, but the XP gain still feels too slow. Part of the charm of leveling WoW alts is burning through zones and skipping most of the quests - it's like you're giving a drive-by middle finger to the long-expired MMO quest grind. Now Wildstar is dangling a carrot of nice art and cool mechanics from a stick of fifty more levels the old fashioned way.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Minsky posted:

If the MMO fails, it doesn't really matter how boring the questing was anyway because the game probably failed in the end game like almost all MMOs tend to do.

MMOs fail explicitly because the questing is boring. (Not to say a bad endgame has never killed an MMO - just that I think losing a critical mass of players because not enough people will finish the grind is the #1 MMO killer.)

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

a cat on an apple posted:

Aside from that, you don't even have to do those fifty levels the old fashioned way. You have to do like, six, and then you unlock PvP Battlegrounds which they have designed as an alternative to leveling up as opposed to questing. You also unlock adventures and dungeons which apparently can also serve the purpose but slightly less effectively. There's actually definitely options, and if you don't like either questing (standard PvE) or battlegrounds (standard PvP) you might want to consider a different genre of gaming.

Definitely two things at work here, then. One, my personal dream of a game with RPG combat that will drop you into a PvP zone at level 1. Planetside with WoW mechanics. Two, how did I spend so much time in that awful tutorial zone and not learn that PvP does start that early? I was legitimately about to walk away from this game at level 4, but now I have to keep going for another hour or so.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."
These green bars are bouncing up and down. What do they mean?

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Rhymenoserous posted:

Huh? The last several MMO's that went F2P specifically did so because there was gently caress all to do after you hit max level. WoW is pretty much living proof that people will put up with lovely questing for ages if there's a decent thing to do at the end of it.

You're right - I'm thinking more of the recent crop of mid-quality freemium MMOs (Neverwinter comes to mind) that are never going to take off due to mediocre questing/gameplay. The psychology is a little different when there's an upfront cost and a monthly sub.

I'm glad I got to level 6. Everything seems to make more sense all of a sudden - the town with the church has established settler booths and the big civic project, which makes me more excited about this path. My medic can finally heal. The PvP owns - the telegraphs are amazing for healing. No more raid frames.

The tutorial is still just as bad the second time through. Skipping all the lore and going as fast as I could, it was still 9 minutes to level 2, the first ~four of which I didn't have a weapon or skills. I know that sounds nitpicky for an MMO, but Wildstar could really make a better first impression.

The official description for the Spellslinger talks about their "acrobatic ability", but after perusing all the class skills, they seem to have the weakest mobility of any class. Am I missing something?

*yeah to hammer on this first impressions point a little more, i ding 2, get this sweet charged shot, and the next quest is to uh... click widgets in a room?

straw man fucked around with this message at 06:39 on May 10, 2014

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

a cat on an apple posted:

It's a shame, because I really liked the concept of the Foundry and player-made content. Most of it was garbage but there was some good stuff out there.

Yeah, that part looked awesome...

Bauxite posted:

Neverwinter is the exact opposite. The questing/gameplay were fine and actually quite a bit of fun, then you hit max level and realized there was absolutely nothing to do.

... but I got bored way before max level.

Is there a class that stands out as more mobile than the others? Just from reading it looks like the Stalker.

In terms of minmaxing money, resources and tradeskills, is it the WoW model where you want to level with dual gathering and do the actual crafting professions later? (I realize this may depend on market forces that won't take shape until release)

e:

J posted:

Got any tips? I've played around that much and my warrior is only 14. I feel like a lot of quests are taking longer than they should just because of lack of enemies to kill or doodads to pick up and having to wait for respawns. I can't imagine how bad it'll be on release with everyone crammed into the same areas. I'm really trying to give this game a legit chance but man it feels like a slog.

I did one battleground at level 6 and got more than half of the level but I don't know if that tapers off

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."
1. Medic is a ton of fun. Cleverly combining the forward and backward blinks means sweet mobility.

2. BijiPlates seems like a necessity for PvP, but I can feel it eating my frames per second. The code looks... seriously over-complex, like it has too many loops and branches supporting too many features. That might be a naive assessment, this is the first WildStar addon I've even looked at, but I bet there will be a better nameplate addon soon.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Sgt. Anime Pederast posted:

So goons are all playing Chua in live, right?

I'm playing an American Cassian.

The player housing is really impressive. I just arrived at level 14 last night - this is a really smart, well-designed housing system. It has a lot of the flexibility Galaxies had without trashing the landscape. This probably sounds lame to some, but sitting on my own property queueing for groups feels exactly how an MMO should feel.

If the PvP stays at Walatiki Temple quality, I think it has a bright future, too. Telegraph healing beats the pants off unit frames, and that battleground is actually a well-balanced, fun game - it's a new innovation on Warsong Gulch-style CTF.

How does the name pre-registration work if I order this through GMG?

e: player "housing"

straw man fucked around with this message at 18:23 on May 11, 2014

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

a cat on an apple posted:

While the tools for Advanced Editing include rotations across the three dimensions as well as a lot of control over scale, there's a few flaws with attempting to create a fully-fledged house. The rotations work on a scale of 6.28, which is to say, from a range of -3.14 to 3.14. This is a little bit confusing, because it ends up with every point for rotation is something like three-fifths of a degree, so you start to get really weird floating point inaccuracies in larger scale modifications.

.573 degrees yeah http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radian

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

a cat on an apple posted:

I figured it was radians. I don't remember how but every time radians came up in school I missed school somehow so I never actually learned how to handle them, so I find it incredibly confusing and unintuitive.

Imagine four balls at the edge of a cliff.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

vanbags posted:

How early can I access PvP matches after downloading the open beta? That's really the only thing I'm interested in with this game to determine whether or not I buy it.

I don't really want to waste my time on trying the beta if I won't get to try out the one thing I'm concerned about.

Level six, it'll take you one or two hours depending which side you pick and how fast you push through the tutorial clickquests.


Iron Tusk posted:

Is it just me or does it seem like being small is an advantage in pvp?

Phrasing posted:

Everyone has the same hitbox so I think its just you.

There is a psychological advantage, you come off as less of a threat.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

vanbags posted:

Sweet, thanks. Is there any type of bolster system to level the playing field or should I expect to get slaughtered at level 6?

Everybody gets boosted to level 14 in the intial BG, but you'll still have the worst gear and fewest skills. It's not an enormous power differential, but you'll get the best results if you're a little cautious as you get comfortable with your skills, survivability, etc.

Oh - if your PC isn't just barely managing to run the game, get BijiPlates. The default nameplates are super unreliable. BijiPlates is a big performance drain but very effective.

straw man fucked around with this message at 20:27 on May 11, 2014

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

tjume posted:

I'm turning off friendly npc nameplates in bijiplates and there is a high chance I'll have to turn them off again with the next login.

Yup. Stock UI components, too, I have to reset my bags to show prestige every time I log in. I hope they're getting bug reports about their unreliable UI configuration persistence.

Poultron posted:

So what does everybody think of the healers in this game? I don't think I'll have enough time personally to level them up to a sufficient level during Open Beta, and frankly the levelling seems slow enough that it will be a bit of a pain to level them all on Live as well. For reference, I play a Mistweaver Monk in WoW - I like the mobility and flexible damage options the class offers.

But really I'm open to whichever one is the most Fun. I'd love to play an Aurin, but they can't be my first 3 class choices :downs: And Spellslinger doesn't really seem like a healing style I'm all about.

EDIT: I should also say that so far I'm not too keen on the Medic's damaging spells. Flavor just isn't right for me, I guess.

I'm also coming from a Mistweaver, and yeah, I think the class to be here is Medic. I wasn't too pleased with the Medic's flavor initially either, but it starts to mesh with the way the class plays. Mobile as can be - two blinks, most heals seem to be A-OK on the move. I think it'll be easy to work a couple DPS skills into the rotation once I have more skill slots open.

Fair warning though - I haven't tried the Esper nor Spellslinger yet.

Dosvidanya posted:

From what I can tell though: Esper is smart heals, Spellslinger is targeted burst heals, and Medic has close ranged aoe/shield heals.

Yeah, this too, Medic's generally close-range and in the melee. It bears some resemblance to fistweaving.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Adam Bowen posted:

Use the proper graphic, showing 2*pi radians in a circle.



More instructive, but less meme-compatible.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Poultron posted:

Game also makes my card run pretty hot, though I have a feeling that's because it's like 90 degrees here.

That's close to what I'd expect on those specs but - no joke - have you cleaned the dust out of your fans and heatsinks lately?

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Poultron posted:

I actually haven't, and probably should. I usually do it about every six months (I know that's too long but I am lazy)

Sometimes it feels like that makes things faster. Could be the placebo effect, though.

One other thing, I don't know if this is widely known but it applies to every game. If the performance is intolerable even at the lowest settings, you can turn the resolution down. It'll look significantly worse, but if you're going from say 1080p to 1200x800, you're cutting the graphics card's workload in half.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Arzachel posted:

This would be good advice if he was CPU limited.

Protokoll posted:

WildStar, like other MMOs is a CPU-bound game.

Arzachel posted:

This is bullshit, the tutorial ships are nowhere near CPU limited even on pretty ancient hardware and the GPU fan noise is a giveaway that it isn't being underutilized.

Might be good to post a screencap of this guy along with performance issues



* which reminds me, more standard windows stuff. defrag if you don't have an ssd, start->run->"msconfig", "hide all microsoft services" and go to town on anything shady in the "services" and "startup" tabs. or if, like me, you've let your windows 7 install rot for eighteen months, just format it and start over

straw man fucked around with this message at 23:37 on May 11, 2014

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

-Inu- posted:

Multi-threading code in games tends to be very difficult to write and causes a large amount of bugs for relatively little gain. Multithreading is awesome for video production and the like, but it's probably never going to see much use in games.

When you multithread, the execution time goes like this



but the developers' paychecks go like this

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Arzachel posted:

Two cores loaded at 30-50%, 100% GPU utilization except when changing graphics settings (performance is identical when closing Opera for another 1GB of RAM)


I'm going out on a limb but if you go into the resource manager->memory tab is the "Hard Faults/sec" graph nonzero? I have a 650TI and it's doing way better than this.

I'm wondering if the 100% utilization means the GPU is just blocking while the OS pages obscenely large texture files between system memory and the disk

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Mormon Star Wars posted:

I have the weirdest bug. Whenever I click on the reputation tab on my character screen, the entire screen except for my UI goes black and I get a "Housing Error: Housing action failed" notice in my chat box. :psyduck: /reloadui reloads the ui, but the rest of the screen is still black.

Maybe try DirectX 9? https://support.wildstar-online.com/entries/30051093-WildStar-crashing-with-DirectX-10-11

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Mercurius posted:

It's an interesting question since Nexus (PVE) has overtaken Pergo (PVP) for preferred server while PVP is still slightly ahead of PVE in general (but there's not much in it). Faction seems to be overwhelmingly Dominion at this point but given the number of people who've voted for PVE and PVP and how close they are I'm kind of wondering if it'd be possible to support both PVE and PVP guilds given both options have over 100 votes. We probably need to make a choice fairly soon since the name/guild reservations are available in a little over a day.

Do we know anything about the specific ruleset on PvP servers? I.e., will carebears suffer badly enough to justify two guilds.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

WarLocke posted:

Is it just me or is Settler really fiddly and grindy?

It does seem minmax-y. Combine with two gathering professions to maximize your strip-mining of the landscape.

Rylek posted:

My vote is still for PvP. Open World PVP adds an element to a fresh MMO that can't be replicated on a PvE server. Seems like the Goon Guild has splintered even before the game has launched!

I said come in! posted:

It's gonna be tough to have everyone play together. We are such a large community. I personally would prefer to be in a guild on a PvE server on the Exile faction.

All I do in these games is PvP but I'll still probably roll on a PvE server. World PvP maybe satisfies some people's "hunter's instinct", but when you can play an actual balanced PvP game at level 6, world PvP sounds a bit like a relic. Being in a big guild matters more to me than the server ruleset.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

I said come in! posted:

I really like MMOs with a good battleground mode. If Wildstar has that then i'll be pretty happy. I enjoy playing battlegrounds in World of Warcraft, Rift, and Star Wars the Old Republic.

Yeah Wildstar's definitely owns up to level 14 at least.

Kelp Plankton posted:

Yeah I have a hard time keeping tabs on anyone. The minimap needs to display arrows around the edge pointing towards your teammates regardless of how far away they are(unless they're a zone away or something I guess). A thing that helps is using the Specific Marker UI function. Right-click people and stick a toaster or flying pig over their head, and you can see those icons from a much further distance than you can their names.

The API is... not yet well documented, but if you can code GPS arrows in WoW they must be trivial here. Really all you need is your own coordinates and your party members' coordinates, then you can do some trigonometry and draw an arrow on the minimap. Bonus points for anybody who can find the relevant functions though: https://github.com/wildstarnasa/NASADocs/blob/master/_G%20Dumps/_G-Nexus-3.30.14.txt

CrashCat posted:

I asked around about the contested zones for PvP servers and it looks like they don't even start until level 20. They haven't really built them with an eye toward PvP from what I can tell so aside from the griefing I don't know of any benefit, and the griefing is gonna be poor when all the low level people who would really rage are safe behind their zone walls. I think if we read the poll as "who wants to sit around all day trying to gank level 20s for Exile tears" the results would be different.

Yeah, I'd have voted PvE if I'd known PvP would be full of carebear fortresses. I'd go PvP if you had open PvP in town, newbie zones, people's houses, etc.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Manifest Dynasty posted:

There is definitely a group radar add-on.

Those were the key words https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/14815-addon-groupradar/
e: that thread suggests GroupCompanion too https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/42202-addon-groupcompanion/

e2: i was getting sort of okay mostly other-class vendor trash gear from the pvp bags but then drat, out of nowhere

straw man fucked around with this message at 16:45 on May 12, 2014

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."
No kidding about adventures being the express train to leveling. First one took maybe half an hour and got me all of 15->16 and 70% of 16->17. DPS still roll on support gear, just like every MMO in history. What are the rewards at the end? That part wasn't explained too explicitly.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

CrashCat posted:

The problem is everyone has a "support" role and the assault role, so literally everyone could make use of two sets. You probably won't see most of the people go away from DPS but anyone could, which is going to make for some lovely loot arguments. The whole 'stats mean different poo poo for different classes' just makes it even more confusing:



So yeah, that's gonna be a total clusterfuck. I'm thinking of keeping a support set but I feel like it would be dishonest of me to roll need on it over the tank or the healer, even though I could be the tank or the healer if they're not around.

That's a cool chart. I feel like people are going to get a little possessive of loot for their own role - I could go DPS in theory, but I haven't bought any DPS skills and my gear all has insight and support power.

The Chua mailbox battleground reward... I guess that's just decorative and doesn't let you get mail on your property (yet)?

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

CrashCat posted:

http://wildstar.silvercircle.net/tradeskills.svg

It's the same as the other tradeskill charts going around but you can click on the boxes on either end to highlight where the items are in each flow. Looks like you can be self-sufficient so long as you avoid Outfitter or Architect, and pick the correct harvesting skill to pair with it.

That's awesome. Simple as it obviously is, I also really like the division between the commodity broker and auctioneer.

Sounds like Outfitter and Architect may be where the money is.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

BadLlama posted:

This may be a far off stretch but does anyone else have Amazon Award Points and can't apply them to the pre-order purchase of Wildstar?

Chatted with support and called them yesterday about this. Guy gave me some evasive answer about reward points not having a US billing address associated with them, I asked him to escalate my feedback ("that's bullshit", in more corporation-friendly words).

So I spent USD on GMG and used the reward points for mother's day presents instead.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

CrashCat posted:

To be fair, CX prices are completely hosed right now due to the ridiculous number of low level players and nobody giving a poo poo about money thanks to the impending wipe. I think we'll see this change a LOT once people are scrambling to liquidate to buy CREDD.

Just because I like to share, here's your "omg wallhax" thread of the day:
https://forums.wildstar-online.com/forums/index.php?/topic/41238-cheated-addon/page-1

Nearly everyone in that thread comes across as a blithering idiot, it's great.

Ohh... I forgot about CREDD. This is gonna be backwards from WoW. The Eve-style empire pubbies will drive the price of raw materials into the ground and the crafters will be the ones making a fortune.

That addon does sound like it will become 100% required on PvP servers.

* agreed though - gathering profs will probably still be the way to go until that first monthly sub hits around the fourth of july

straw man fucked around with this message at 20:57 on May 12, 2014

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

a cat on an apple posted:

Currently, things are incredibly cheap off of the Commodity Exchange. There should be inflation at launch when people actually care about making money, because of CREDDs, but even then, there's this Schematic that you immediately unlock - Metal Plank - that for 30 Copper has a ~98% chance to become a Metal Platform, which sells at vendors for 18 Silver. It only requires 3 Iron Chunks.

Even if you buy Iron Chunks from a Vendor, you still profit by about 50 Copper per Iron Chunk. That's how efficient that Schematic is. It would take a net worth of 6.5ish Silver per Iron Chunk for Metal Platforms to become negligibly or otherwise not profitable; at which point, you probably might as well grab the Mining Tradeskill and get a House set up with Mining Plugs to make bank off of the inflation anyway.

Well, that's good to know. I just "corrected" the market up to about 5.5 silver on my server (these auction houses are probably server-specific?). Guess I'll be able to buy a mount in the beta after all.

* aww yeah the pubbies bounced it up to 8 silver per chunk on the ask and they're still filling my 75 copper bid

straw man fucked around with this message at 22:47 on May 12, 2014

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

KittyEmpress posted:

Overall it felt really slow, and the engineer's special mechanic (volatality) may have contributed to that, since I had to get 3-4 basic shots off before I could use one of my other skills. Might try an Esper later today, or maybe a spellslinger.

Word is that Esper and Engineer are the least mobile early on - mobility seems like a lot of what makes this game click. I've had good results with Medic, Warriors look very mobile, and yeah, Spellslingers are supposed to be, too.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Mount Desert posted:

Nice, I bought 1000 ore off the CV and macroed a script for Metal Platforms for an extra 25g and no work.

Hopefully the prices get readjusted before launch.

It's even more broken on the Apprentice tier, three titanium chunks (used to be 3 silver each on my server) craft into a 29s Silver Keg. Looks like it stops on the next tier though.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."
One feature that hasn't gotten much discussion is the crafting minigame, which is quite sophisticated and fun - there's a "crafting table" with a small target on it. The goal is to move a point from the center of the table to the target. You get three "moves", which you choose from a menu, each move having a specific but slightly random distance and direction. If you hit the target, you get the "improved" version of the item you were crafting. Sometimes there are multiple targets.

Most engaging crafting gameplay I've seen since SWG, too.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Doublestep posted:

Is there a certain point where this starts happening? When I was doing weaponsmithing I just overloaded points on X stat until it said "1% chance to fail" and pressed Craft.

Maybe the minigame is new or architect-only?

a cock shaped fruit posted:

It's kind of like golf. You start at the tee, and have 3 shots - and you can see where your shot will land before you take it. So you try and choose the 3 shots that will land in the hole. I love it.

Sometimes the target will be obscured by a fog of war, and finding it is trial and error, with a huge tradeskill exp bonus for discovering it.

That's it - it's golf. I haven't seen that fog of war yet...

The listing fees on architect stuff are pretty prohibitive, at least for the apprentice tier. It's a good excuse to raise prices though

straw man fucked around with this message at 01:05 on May 13, 2014

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Bussamove posted:

It's fun if you have people you enjoy raiding with. I did it for several years in WoW and about a year in Rift because I enjoyed shooting the poo poo with the people I was dying to bosses with. If you don't like/don't talk to your group then it's a lot more dull.

Monotonous as it can be, MMO raiding is kind of the only game in town for large-scale online co-op. Not a lot of other genres where your 24-39 best friends can play on the same team, with an endless bench of pubbie recruits when your friends can't make it.

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."
Their site's getting DDOSed pretty bad (with the best of intentions) isn't it

straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."

Soothing Vapors posted:

Yep. I have no idea how they didn't think this was going to happen.

Guys it will be fine just bump up to the next AWS tier

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straw man
Jan 5, 2011

"You're a bigger liar than I am."
The 404 page itself, just the components that I can get to load, is more than a meg. Amateurs

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