Mechanical Keyboards- Justify this please?????

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Serious Hardware/Software Crap > Mechanical Keyboards- Justify this please?????

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Khorne: May 1, 2002

Is Ducky actually a quality brand? In my experience, their poo poo breaks within 2 years. It happened with two separate keyboards that sat on my desk and didn't take any abuse. One of them the frame broke but it was otherwise usable and the other it just stopped working after only working intermittently. Part of the issue was the micro usb port, the solder job was atrocious. I fixed that, but it still didn't work. Part of it could be both were the cheapest tenkeyless available in 2010-2011. The plastic right below the keys is paper tier. You could press it with a pen and deform it. Back then you had to order from taiwan/hong kong to get them.

In contrast, I have a cheap leopold and the only thing that has broken are commonly used keycaps. After a while they start popping off while typing or playing games. That's pretty normal for the level of use I put it through over the 5 1/2 years I've owned it, I guess, no real complaint there. I think there's an issue with the switch in my a key as well because it repeats after being held down far less than any other key. But again, this is after an insane amount of use that most people wouldn't put a keyboard through in 20 years.

I'm kind of looking to purchase another tenkeyless keyboard with mx browns. I'm open to suggestions, if it came with great keycaps and o-rings preinstalled I'd be up for paying a decent premium. Things I dislike are media keys and backlighting. I suppose I could just get a filco or wait until leopolds are in stock somewhere if I want the same keyboard for less.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 18:18 on Jul 1, 2017

# ¿ Jul 1, 2017 15:40

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# ¿ May 14, 2024 13:41

Khorne: May 1, 2002

How do I fix keys from chattering? My W key repeats itself like 20 times every time I press it now. It didn't do it before. A key is also like this and R.

Also, what is the cheapest place to get keycaps that won't break after a year or two of use? I guess the keycaps that came with my cheap and garbage ducky that they cut every other possible corner on are still trucking 7 years later, but the leopold caps are straight trash. I need to order two sets of keycaps.

# ¿ Jan 22, 2018 23:51

Khorne: May 1, 2002

AgentCow007 posted:

Why are you under the impression that free return shipping is a common thing?

Pretty much any serious business does it. Especially ones that want to grow, inspire consumer confidence, and make sales. It's the literal standard for quality ecommerce businesses.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 05:00 on Feb 5, 2018

# ¿ Feb 5, 2018 04:49

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Why are most keycaps not polycarbonate? I tried looking it up and people say it scratches easily, but it actually doesn't in the context of keycaps. We're not talking about lenses here.

# ¿ Feb 6, 2018 14:52

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Just how much do rubber o-rings dampen sound?

Fats posted:

I was looking for the same thing and ended up getting a Leopold 750, though I've heard the Filcos are nice too. The Leopolds come in good color schemes.

I don't know the situation now, but a lot of my leopold PBT keycaps snapped where the stem goes in just from typing and gaming. WASD/R/T/Y/J/K/L all did.

I've replaced them with the ducky ABS caps I had laying around and those have held up just fine. The ABS caps are shiny and get fingernail imprints sometimes, but they seem to hold up fine in the medium term.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 02:53 on Mar 26, 2018

# ¿ Mar 26, 2018 02:51

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Fats posted:

Hm, that�s worrying. This thing is destined for work, so I guess I�ll see how it holds up.

Honestly, PBT are supposed to be better. I might really slam keys hard compared to most people. Especially in games that require fast and accurate input. While typing I can mostly avoid bottoming out, but while gaming it's slam city.

When I type the keys coming up are loud as hell and when I game the keys bottoming out are loud as hell.

# ¿ Mar 26, 2018 12:46

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Constellation I posted:

Yeah, but silencing clips are not. Zealllllllll

Holy poo poo those are expensive when they cost literal pennies to manufacture.

# ¿ Mar 26, 2018 17:35

Khorne: May 1, 2002

TheFluff posted:

MX browns on the other hand have pretty much a full millimeter of travel before you start noticing the tactile bump at all, and it�s much less sharp. As mentioned, it�s pretty much a linear switch with a small bump in the middle of the stroke. It�s not what I want from a tactile switch.

Except it gives out completely once it actuates. Which makes it not linear at all.

For brown you have pressing->about to actuate->actuated+gave out

For reds/blacks/linears you have pressing-> and that's it.

For reds you feel pretty much nothing except a point of peak resistance when it bottoms out. For browns you know when it actuated because it goes from resisting to not resisting. I'll be honest, I've used all the cherry switches and browns are my favorite. But that's from the perspective of typing >130wpm and mashing on keys. I can type the same speed on all of the switches. Browns are just the switch I prefer. Low actuation force, a very clear tactile curve of pressed vs not pressed, no click.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 18:06 on Mar 29, 2018

# ¿ Mar 29, 2018 18:00

Khorne: May 1, 2002

What keyboard I should buy?

I've owned a ducky tkl with mx browns that died in a year or two and a leopold tkl with reds I've owned for 5-6 years where there's debounce issues developing with the a/r/w keys and around 1/3 the keycaps have broken where the stem goes in. Thankfully, I had that dead ducky to steal caps from and the ducky's caps have never broken.

I'm fine with any switch that's light and not loud. MX brown-like preferred, but I've used reds for 6 years and just don't care that much.

I'd like a tenkeyless again, because larger keyboards encroach mouse space while properly positioned for typing.

I have a ton of washers sitting around but if it came with them preinstalled that'd be great. I type ultra loud on any keyboard, even scissor switches.

Cheap, decent key rollover, durable would be my main priority more than any specific brand of switch. I also don't like backlights or rgb anything, and I don't care about colors.

I was also wondering if there's something I could do with the dead ducky. I have soldering tools. I'm pretty sure it was just the micro usb port that died, although that ducky I have is ultra cheaply made and the frame itself is warped too. It has a bunch of perfectly fine mx brown switches just sitting on the board. Although it seems like cherry fixed their supply issues and switches are cheaper now than before.

And while I'm here, is there a way to fix or replace the few red switches giving me problems on this keyboard? I use contact cleaner pretty regularly on the 2-4 that cause problems and it fixes it for a few weeks to a few months.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 15:24 on Jul 11, 2019

# ¿ Jul 11, 2019 15:21

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Llamadeus posted:

Do you mean like, short of opening up the case, desoldering the switches and soldering a bunch of new switches?

Nah, I could probably do that soldering part. Are there any detailed guides explicitly for mechanical keyboards?

Khorne fucked around with this message at 16:56 on Jul 11, 2019

# ¿ Jul 11, 2019 16:53

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Llamadeus posted:

Never done it myself, but there are a bunch of videos on youtube so it can't be too complicated.

Nice, once I get a new keyboard I'll replace a few switches in this one as a side project.

# ¿ Jul 11, 2019 16:58

Khorne: May 1, 2002

mewse posted:

Ducky and leopold are both premium brands with really good build quality so it�s weird you�ve had problems with both of them.

Ducky wasn't premium at the time. They had huge QC issues in 2010-2011. They've since fixed them. I just bought it from them because it was $30 cheaper than any other manufacturer at the time.

Leopold, the keyboard is great but the key caps break. The small round part that goes over the stem cracks apart in 1-2 places. It took ~2 years of use for it to happen. wertyasdfghjopkl have all had it happen so far.

The switch issue is inevitable with any kind of mechanical switch and not Leopold's fault. I likely can take it apart and clean it thoroughly and it will be fixed.

mewse posted:

There are a million great TKL boards since you like that layout. I�d suggest the velocifire TKL01 which has clone brown switches for super cheap.

I'll check it out. Thanks for the help!

Khorne fucked around with this message at 20:17 on Jul 11, 2019

# ¿ Jul 11, 2019 20:15

Khorne: May 1, 2002

I ordered a hexgears gk707. It was $40 for an 87 key kailh hot swappable keyboard that comes with, presumably kailh, box browns. I don't know what to expect, but when it finally arrives from China I'll make sure to complain about it and possibly put zilent v2s into a $10-$20 keyboard.

All signs seem to hint that it's actually pretty good and that I won't even bother ordering overpriced zilent switches.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 00:22 on Jul 17, 2019

# ¿ Jul 16, 2019 23:20

Khorne: May 1, 2002

My GK707 with box browns came in. Space bar was 10x louder than any mechanical key I've ever heard, backspace pretty loud too, but putting orings under the key cap at the stabilizers fixed them both.

Box browns feel pretty good. It's a little weird to me that they don't just give out like the mx browns do, but they're solid.

Does anyone have a preference for getting orings to work with them? That's my main complaint right now. I forgot how loud mechanical keyboards are without orings. I can hear it super loud through closed headphones. I found a post on r/mechanical keyboards that says to just buy smaller ones and stuff them into the cap. Is that actually going to work well or should I just order different switches like I had planned?

Khorne fucked around with this message at 01:32 on Jul 30, 2019

# ¿ Jul 30, 2019 00:38

Khorne: May 1, 2002

HappyCapybaraFamily posted:

There's this wacky method of putting small 4mm O-rings inside the switch housing. Here are the exact kind I used: https://smile.amazon.com/uxcell-4mmx1mm-Nitrile-Resistant-Grommets/dp/B01MTNJ7FI

I found it worth it, but be forewarned that it is going to be tedious. I recommend some way of sorting all the parts of each disassembled switch so you don't lose any, and using some kind of curved tweezers.

I didn't even have the patience to do all the keys the normal way. I did the letters + space + shift + enter over the course of almost two weeks.

# ¿ Jul 30, 2019 03:06

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Jowj posted:

SOAPBOX: i have a different niche opinion, and that is that the 6 key should be on /both/ sides!

Left hand is the only hand the 6 matters on! With how I position my hand I can't even reach the 6 with my right hand.

# ¿ Jul 31, 2019 16:17

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Jowj posted:

Hi Khorne!!

whoa how do you position your hands whaaaat? Are you positioned over homerow? Do you have Small Hands?

I have wide hands but my fingers are really average length. And shorter than my palm. Mouse measurement wise, my hands are a bit longer than average and quite a bit wider than average.

I can reach 6 with either hand the same way. I'm just not used to doing it with the right hand, and I tend to aggressively angle my right hand with my palm kinda sideways so it takes a bit more motion.

As far as hand size, I hit up to ctrl+9 in rts games with left ctrl and my index finger. So not that small I guess, but I can't reach left ctrl + 0.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 17:43 on Jul 31, 2019

# ¿ Jul 31, 2019 17:37

Khorne: May 1, 2002

I ordered a new keycap set because too many of my old keys had the part that holds the stem snap. My leopold fc200r has nonstandard stabilizer spacing on the space bar apparently. Is there any technique people recommend for changing slot position on the new space bar?

My current plan is cut the stabilizer slots off the new key and then try to epoxy/soldering-iron-weld them onto the correct position for my keyboard. I've never really worked with pbt tho so I don't know how practical this plan is. I can already see matching height is going to be a pain.

shovelbum posted:

I'm not a keyboard guy but I got a wasd code with browns and love it for various general typing, just feels like a higher quality keyboard without being anything in particular

I've used a decent number of switches and I am firmly in the camp of "any tactile switch with a predictable actuation point at or after the bump that requires 40-70 to press is a great choice for actually using a keyboard and not doing the keyboard equivalent of wine tasting". I haven't actually tried 80 switches but I suspect they also fall into that "it's all the same when you're actually using them" range. Browns meet that criteria.

Linear is fine too. There's nothing wrong with them. Tactile does seem to have a very tiny advantage in most use cases. Not enough to get my frugal, lazy rear end to switch from reds back to tactile at home. I even have the switches sitting here on my desk, but desoldering 87 keys doesn't seem like a good time.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 20:49 on Apr 9, 2020

# ¿ Apr 9, 2020 19:32

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Discussion Quorum posted:

I took a quick dip into the mechanical keyboard world and bought a Velocifire with Otemu Brown switches. I realize it's a cheap lovely keyboard with cheap lovely switches but it was $25 and was good enough to see if I liked using a TKL mechanical keyboard (I do).

The noise level is an issue though, especially now that I'm working longish hours and sometimes into the night. My wife is a light sleeper and my workspace is near our bedroom door. Are Cherry MX Browns or Silent Reds (thinking of a Ducky One 2, if it matters) quiet enough to use in a shared space, or does that more or less rule out mechanical keyboards in general? I found some videos on YouTube but that doesn't really show how the sound carries when one is typing at full tilt (nor, I imagine, would a key tester).

Not familiar with otemu switch, but if you want to reduce volume O Rings help a whole lot. It looks like Otemu switches are box-like so you need to be careful about what orings you buy. The larger ones won't fit. ORings are $2-$6 for 100 if you don't buy them from a mechanical keyboard shop.

It's worth noting that they mostly dampen the noise when going down. The noise on key up is dampened slightly by orings but it's still pretty loud. So figure out whether the noise is coming from the down or upstroke. If it's both then orings will help.

I personally like 008 70A orings, but they don't fit on my box browns. Some googling may find oring size and hardness that works well with otemus.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 17:59 on Apr 16, 2020

# ¿ Apr 16, 2020 17:37

Khorne: May 1, 2002

FAT32 SHAMER posted:

I think I�ve settled on the Redox from Falbatech. Does anyone know if Zelios v2 78g are able to hotsswap? Their website says

Hot swap boards are usually 3 pin but you really can just clip or cut the extra 2 plastic feet off.

# ¿ Apr 17, 2020 03:18

Khorne: May 1, 2002

What 75% keyboards with full tkl keys or at least with home/pgup/pgdown/end on the right and full size f1-f12 are out there?

I ordered a keycool84 and the case was warped so it wobbled everytime I pressed backspace and leveling the lower corner didn't fix it due to how warped it was. The seller has no more in stock so is just refunding.

Vortext rac3 is a no-go because the f# keys are tiny, top most row is missing some keys, and overall it misses the entire point of a 75%.

Akko 3084 seems okay and I might order it, but all of the ones in stock ship from Hong Kong or Taiwan. Which is normally fine, but pandemic shipping from that region is massively impacted. There have also been similar QA issues with it to what I had with the keycool84. From pictures, it looks like the non-slip rubber feet suck so that's another $10 from ebay to order good material for feet and more of my time to modify it. Its wireless implementation also sucks, but I am going to use it wired so don't care.

I'm open to kits because I have some gateron silent browns sitting around I've been meaning to solder into something and desoldering is time consuming and tedious. Everything I found seems sold out. kbd75 v1 might be good but it looks like home/pgdown position is not there and some useless keys are instead. It's also always sold out

After actually trying 75% I want to switch to it now. Nothing about it annoyed me, and it's really easy to press the f# keys/pgup/pgdown/home/end quickly while typing or gaming.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 19:20 on May 13, 2020

# ¿ May 13, 2020 18:53

Khorne: May 1, 2002

FAT32 SHAMER posted:

this has primarily revealed that i always press b with my right index instead of my left and i use my left index for c and my left middle for x

rip my 90wpm typing speed for a while

That's all pretty normal. The optimal way to type, ignoring steno, involves using multiple fingers for each key depending on letter combinations in the word, what you just typed, and what's coming next.

# ¿ May 13, 2020 21:52

Khorne: May 1, 2002

I wish gmmk would release a 75%. Heck, I wish all the tkls in the world became 75% keyboards. I've no idea why TKL became super popular instead of 75%. I mean, TKL is more aesthetic I guess but 75% has better functionality.

I suppose one reason is different people want different keys in the right-most column, but that's a solvable problem.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 22:21 on May 17, 2020

# ¿ May 17, 2020 22:18

Khorne: May 1, 2002

What experiences do people here have with making stabilizers quieter?

I have an older leopold tkl where the spacebar stab is squeaking really loud. I also have a keycool84 75% where the stab is the loudest part of it because I have orings + replaced the mx browns with gateron silent browns. Which is amazing by the way, silent switches are really quiet and the gsbs are wonderful.

My concern with lube or whatever is I am not desoldering all 84+ keys, and I want something that will take minimal maintenance. I might be willing to desolder the leopold switches and replace them with something else as they're old mx reds and actuation force is ~3/4 normal on a lot of the keys.

edit: both are plate mount

Khorne fucked around with this message at 23:47 on May 18, 2020

# ¿ May 18, 2020 23:04

Khorne: May 1, 2002

quote:

EDIT: Just saw plate mount. In that case they are either costar or cherry plates? You shouldn't need to desolder anything if costar, or just one switch if cherry. The first thing I usually do is just buy new ones and replace them. Plate mounts loosen up over time and start rattling. You can try using plumbers tape or something on the edges to tighten them up again as well.

mewse posted:

I've lubed stabs and on my last build a week ago I put a thin layer of synthetic grease. It gets rid of the rattle.

You should be able to pull the stabs by just desoldering the switch being stabilized. Should be a horizontal slot in the plate to pull it out once the keyswitch is removed.

e: assuming plate-mount stabs

If it's just one switch per stabilizer set that's no big deal. The keycool doesn't squeak or anything. Just very loud when a stabilized key is quickly released especially if pressed down quickly.

AbsoluteLlama posted:

What kind of stabs? Cherry I'm guessing? You should be able to get some grease into the moving bits with just the keycap pulled off. It may take awhile for it to work itself in. Not that high maintenance but you'd have to be careful not to make a terrible mess.

Desoldering is probably the way to go though if you really want it to be the best. Topclack has a good stab guide: https://topclack.com/textclack/2018/4/29/the-stab-lab-a-stabilizer-modification-guide-by-quakemz. You really want to overdo the lube on the stabs. I use teflon grease on the plastic bits, then dunk the wires past the bend into a tube of dielectric grease multiple times.

You may want to test these sorts of mods on another board first though as it will change the feel and it's a matter of taste. I love modded stabs, but my wife absolutely hates them and swears by squeaky costar stabs. YMMV.

Mostly worried about the noise it makes when the key is on the way back up. It slaps into something and is very loud for space/backspace in particular. Not very concerned with feel as long as the switch works normally and as far as I know it will.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 03:27 on May 19, 2020

# ¿ May 19, 2020 03:17

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Eyud posted:

PBT caps are so worth it. This is after three years:

I'd avoid certain PBT caps. I bought the $30 doubleshot razer set in a pinch and it started shining within a week. The function keys also have pad printed volume icons that don't match the set and they conveniently hide it in the pictures of the set. I thought it was reasonably priced because razer made a ton of them or something, but it turns out it's like every other razer product and just junk.

The real cheap sideprinted sets on amazon that go for ~$20 are great if you want a cheap set that doesn't shine. They're smoother than other pbt caps but nice enough for the price. I forgot what they're a rebrand of, but it's one of the two companies that pump out cheap sets of okay quality. Their durability is a bit questionable, the part that holds the stem seems to be deforming on a few because it is really thin and a very sharp angle which isn't a good design for this type of material. So far they're fine though.

Probably going to end up buying a nice PBT set pretty soon. I hate spending money ~~on keyboard stuff~~, but I use my keyboard with silent switches for work and having shiny caps doesn't look great when people are at your desk. Of course with covid, maybe I'll wait because we're working from home until the end of the year.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 20:50 on Jun 9, 2020

# ¿ Jun 9, 2020 20:39

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Does anyone have aliaz and know the pre-travel distance? I switched to gateron silent browns recently and the pre-travel distance is noticeably farther than my old mx reds. I've been using them for a month or two now, and the key has to travel too far to be pressed while typing. Looking to replace them with something that has less pretravel distance. It sucks that the speed switches don't have silent variants because they'd be nice for typing.

also, my gsbs tend to get "stuck" at the bottom. Is there a reason this happens and anything I can check? They don't get fully stuck they just sometimes have a large delay (~50ms-100ms) before they spring up. Seems to happen frequently with keys that are held down, like w in wasd games, alt/win during some key combinations, and right shift which I use almost exclusively. It doesn't happen when I quickly tap any of the keys, even if I bottom out with force.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 14:44 on Jun 12, 2020

# ¿ Jun 12, 2020 14:38

Khorne: May 1, 2002

If you wanna talk about questionable imagery in gaming and logos that are annoying, how about skypad. I imagine the design process had "oh, we should turn that second one around and put it at an angle" said at some point during it. The worst part is the creator loves the logo to the point they don't even give you the option to remove it or get a smaller logo on your mousepad. It's annoying as heck, but they have a literal monopoly on fps-sized glass pads right now.

Blue Footed Booby posted:

They had the decency to drop "master" from "pc master race," at least...

The logo is a fat neckbeard with an unkempt beard & hair. It's a dumb joke about console and mobile being inferior. Despite the allusion, and how tone deaf it is in general, it's a fairly inclusive mentality. "pc gaming race" is anyone who pc games, and anyone can join the pc gaming race by pc gaming.

Most of their products have minimal to no branding on purpose, and they actively lose customers with their current branding because people find it offensive or cringe. There's a reason most people call the company "glorious", and that's really what they should rebrand to with no logo/logo under the product being their standard.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 14:00 on Aug 8, 2020

# ¿ Aug 8, 2020 13:55

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Rinkles posted:

I mostly miss the dedicated F keys. TKL could be the way to go, but I think 60%+F row might be ideal.

70%/75% are awesome because they have f keys, ins, home, end, del, pgup, pg down when built correctly. They frequently have ortho F keys which are a double edged sword. If you don't know how to hit your normal F keys then "1 but higher" is easy. If you're good at typing then they're slightly inferior to staggered. Especially if you regularly use right side of keyboard f keys with left hand while gaming or mousing.

I've always been surprised that 70%/75% didn't catch on because it's real nice. Sub 70 is largely aesthetic/fashion and is missing too much functionality for my tastes. In the tasks that don't require the extra keys they are cool.

I had a keycool 84 but it has 45ms input latency which is unbelievably stupid. It registers key downs pretty fast (appears to report at 1000Hz, very little debounce delay on key down) but it only registers key ups 45ms after a key down. This kills double taps and destroys shift key functionality while typing. It effectively gives it a 22Hz scan rate despite its actual scan rate being much faster.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 20:11 on Nov 28, 2021

# ¿ Nov 28, 2021 15:57

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Taffer posted:

I did not know this, thanks.

After doing a lot more looking it sounds like the KBD67 will be a great fit. I hadn't really considered it before, and now I wish it was easier to get a great kit like this for an split board for my own use

Make sure you say "yes" to foam. There's nothing worse than case ping. The first thing I do to any new keyboard now is stuff as much foam into the thing as I can. The second thing is bandaid modding & lubing the space bar stabilizer.

I also put big fat orings, sometimes two high, asap much to the horror of 95% of the thread when they read this. Don't do that.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 23:45 on Nov 30, 2021

# ¿ Nov 30, 2021 23:33

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Taffer posted:

Wait, it doesn't come with it? The description made it sound like it did and I already ordered it. Well, I guess I can order it separately if that turns out to be true

It might come with it. I just saw it was an option. If it comes with it then you're good. If it doesn't, you can usually use any kind of foam you have laying around. Including packing foam.

Neurosis posted:

Imagining how bad this is for anyone who innocently bought this then tried to play a fighting game loool (keyboards are actually pretty good for fighting games, def better than a normal controller for Tekken, before anyone finds the idea weird).

Going to a modern keyboard with low debounce time, high scan rate, high polling rate was crazy, because keyups were what the game I played relied on. It was jarring that certain movements were happening up to 200ms earlier. I am no longer playing at the limit of my keyboard and instead I am limited by my inputs. I have been spending time retraining myself to tap much faster and not take weird tempo breaks. On the positive tho, it wasn't exactly a fighting game and playing smoothly is a valuable skill that the keyboard forced me into.

The other weird thing switching to a keyboard with lower delay is learning to time shift differently. I was holding shift down way too long on the old keyboard and it instantly showed.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 16:46 on Dec 1, 2021

# ¿ Dec 1, 2021 15:43

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Exit Strategy posted:

In other news:
I'm designing a mouse, because literally every mouse in existence sucks. If they're not fragile hardware built down to a price in order to maximize profit, they're the Ploopy, and if they're not that then they have an obscene sack-of-hotdogs shaped software package that might install a crypto miner on your computer.

Like the Ploopy, it'll be running on a PixArt sensor and using QMK. Unlike the Ploopy, it'll be compatible with a large variety of switch types because that's how I roll.

e: I call it Eyes of Tomorrow.

Ploopy looks like it gets slaughtered by the MM720 (minus gamer holes & rgb) in terms of comfort/ergonomic design. That's without even touching on weight, where the MM720 is 49g, which is one of the biggest factors for comfort and ergonomics when it comes to mice.

Mice suffer mostly from trying to design shapes to appeal to as many people as possible. If companies were more willing to create hyper-polarizing shapes and offer a variety of sizes of that shape then the mouse market would be so much better. Everyone has different hands and people hold mice differently.

Open source firmware is great. I wish all kb and mice manufacturers open sourced their firmware and/or let you flash your own. It's my biggest hope for a 2022 trend.

Apologies if I missed the point of the ploopy -- if it does something weird like use keyboard switches then that went entirely over my head because their promotional page is... questionable.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 09:41 on Dec 7, 2021

# ¿ Dec 7, 2021 08:32

Khorne: May 1, 2002

anothergod posted:

I use MX Cherry browns. Finding a keyswitch that had lower actuation forces was my first idea, too. I'm also wondering if it's my typing style. I find that doing something like a double letter really slows me down? Then I was thinking i was bottoming out a lot. How do people train themselves not to do that? Is that even how people type faster? I'm consciously trying to only push down as lightly as possible, but I am very prone to errors like this. I feel like this is like asking questions about proper form for walking, but I guess that's where I am now.

Browns & bottoming out are both fine. Especially if it's a quick bottom out. Brown resistance after the hump is lower so it's not too concerning to bottom out slightly even if you're rapidly bringing your finger up after.

This might be a feedback issue. The flat keys have no feedback so you just mash them out. Maybe you're waiting for feedback or overthinking bottoming out.

It could be a key motion issue. Down+up should be a rapid, single, continuous motion. That's a given on a flat keyboard and a bit different motion on a keyboard with travel.

There's two main ways to build speed: to type accurately and build up from there and to force speed during some practice sessions so you get used to it. The former is generally preferable & sounds like what you're doing, but if you're plateauing the latter is useful to mix in too. Pushing yourself to be faster during some practice sessions while sacrificing accuracy should help catch you back up to the old keyboard speed.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 20:08 on Dec 7, 2021

# ¿ Dec 7, 2021 19:45

Khorne: May 1, 2002

KB enthusiast community is lowkey sleeping on how good huntsman v2's silenced linear switches are. Best, and ?only?, silenced linear speed switch on the market. Too bad it's a proprietary optical format. 1.2mm actuation, doesn't even feel silenced compared to other silenced switches until you bottom out (&even then it's not gummy/sticky like gateron/cherry silenced), 4mm travel which might let you naturally avoid bottoming out if you're used to 3.x especially when combined with the low actuation distance, ~45g actuation so fairly stiff feeling, lower noise than gateron & cherry silents to the point you don't need orings, and super super smooth out of the box -- not sure if this is due to the switch design or them dry lubing it at the factory.

I mean okay, that description is not for everyone, but if it's for you... it's the one switch I haven't seen anyone talking about. I bought a huntsman v2 tkl during black friday as a temp keyboard that I was going to return and ended up keeping it as a daily driver. I do have some longterm concerns about not being able to replace switches if one goes bad. Also, stabilizer for space was crazy loud of the box. Easy to lube.

Combination of low actuation distance and firm-feeling silent is what I genuinely like the most about it. I've wanted to try speed switches for ages but there being no silent offering really killed it for me. Also, ordering it from best buy and getting it the next day and not having to fiddle with soldering in new switches, lubing stuff (except stabs, I guess some things never change), whether the keyboard has good debounce latency/keyup/keydown timing, etcetc was a nice experience compared to how I've purchased my other keyboards.

Their tactile switch isn't great in comparison. To the point I wouldn't even really consider it over a normal mx compatible keyboard.

please enthusiast market, 35g-45g silent linear switch 1.1mm-1.2mm actuation & 4mm bottom out distance. It feels weird using a mainstream keyboard for the first time in nearly 15 years.

skipdogg posted:

Generally I do just get him whatever he asks for, but this was just more of a sanity check for me. He doesn't care about the brand, and doesn't know anything about the different switch types. He just wants something smaller and when I looked on Amazon with him the Razer was the first one that came up. I just wanted to make sure it wasn't a piece of junk before I dropped 90 bucks on it. He's turning 10 and just getting into this stuff, and odds are he'll switch focus in about 2 months to something else. (Ask me about all the high end speedcubes I've bought him that he isn't interested in anymore) If someone said the Razer was garbage and to get him a Corsair K65 or a HyperX or something else I'd run it by him first and make sure he was cool with it.

Razer seems decent and that's the one he wants, so I'll go with that one. Thanks all.

Only real downside of the mini is it doesn't come with foam inside so it might be kind of pingy. You can easily add foam, like literally any foam you have laying around or $5 of eva foam from a hobby store or amazon, later if it sounds hollow/pingy.

Razer's recent generation of keyboards are pretty good. A few years ago gaming keyboards were trash but quite a few vendors have legitimate entries now.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 03:48 on Dec 13, 2021

# ¿ Dec 13, 2021 03:00

Khorne: May 1, 2002

mewse posted:

Gateron has silent blacks, reds, and (on novelkeys) yellows, all linears

They have a higher actuation distance so aren't "speed" style. That was the joke, they're best in class as the only entry in the class. Gateron's silent switches aren't good imo. They get stuck down sometimes during heavy use. They also don't silence that well & still benefit a bunch from orings despite the mushy/gummy feel without them.

Admittedly I've only tried silent browns from gateron. It's possible this issue doesn't exist on their silent linears or tactiles with heavier springs. I used them for a while and they worked great for typing, but for gaming and prolonged presses I ran into the key getting stuck issue. I even resoldered new switches in where it happened & disassembled the old ones & tried non-lubed vs lubed and still had the issue with keys like wasd in fps. It didn't always happen, or even usually happen, but during a night of fps gaming it'd happen at least once which is one too many times for me. I've never had one get stuck while typing & still use gateron silent browns on my work keyboard.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 04:17 on Dec 13, 2021

# ¿ Dec 13, 2021 03:52

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Llamadeus posted:

Boba(gum)s are the pretty popular silent switches right now, but they're on the opposite end of the scale with silencing pads even softer than Gateron's.

Mushy is fine by me as long as they don't get stuck. I don't really feel the keypress while using them so value that way less than most. I was admittedly happy with the gateron silent browns until I started playing fps games & other games that required holding the key down for a while. Having your "W" key not go up when you need it to is real tilting & makes you immediately think you've made the wrong hardware choice.

52g bobas seem pretty nice as far as silenced linear go. Looks like a whole bunch of new switches have come out over the past few years that I haven't paid attention to.

quote:

It also occured to me that frankensteining a silent speed switch could be an option for the desperate, eg a silent ink stem in a gateron silver housing (this probably works right?).

Strongly considering trying something like this as a hobby project. I figured I wouldn't care much about actuation distance, but now I am addicted to both short actuation distance & silent switches & light springs. Previously only addicted to light springs & silent switches.

Now to find a 75% kb to put them in... really like the ortho function keys for a number of games vs the normal one. This might be harder than frankensteining my own switches given lots of the 70% keyboards have bad underlying hardware or make questionable choices about which keys to include on the right side.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 04:30 on Dec 13, 2021

# ¿ Dec 13, 2021 04:04

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Unsinkabear posted:

I need this silenced linear speed option in a split keyboard that doesn't carry some insane $350+ premium just for the privilege of combining ergo with hotswap or decent switch choices (cough Ergodox Pro). Why won't this industry cater to my niche within a niche within a niche?

One annoying thing about "speed" switches is they're a bit slower for double taps if you bottom out. Especially if key up is the part of the keystroke that registers in whatever you're double tapping in. They're nice to type on though.

Might try to get some of the boba silent switches and see how I like them in my other kb.

# ¿ Dec 13, 2021 06:07

Khorne: May 1, 2002

HappyCapybaraFamily posted:

It looks like Mode have all but announced a SeventyFive:

Exploded f keys is an annoying choice. It's only really done due to familiarity & aesthetic. After using f keys over the number row I will never go back to exploded. It's just better for actually using the keys even though it takes a few weeks (or months if you rarely use the f keys) to get used to. Not the biggest fan of most 75s doing it ortho, but at this point ortho f keys over the number row is all I've ever used so who knows if I'd prefer staggered. Probably because natural finger travel is slightly staggered at most reasonable typing angles for me.

Much easier to hit with shift in rts-likes, much easier to hit without moving your hand in general so you can still press other keys with the other fingers, much easier to learn the location of for new typists "8 but higher", less travel distance, and brings up to f10 in range of my index finger while hitting left shift vs f8 with a normal layout.

On the plus, the right side seems compact and the pgup/pgdown/home/end location are great for pretty much everything that uses those keys. Also superior to a normal layout because it's in range of your pinky while typing. I use home/end/pgup/pgdown all of the time for work.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 01:56 on Jan 21, 2022

# ¿ Jan 20, 2022 22:10

Khorne: May 1, 2002

Minorkos posted:

Anyone with a Huntsman V2, do the keys actuate accidentally very often when playing games? I'm kinda interested in one but I'm worried of accidental keypresses, which was my issue with a Xtrfy K4

It's likely you're going to accidentally press keys a whole bunch when trying it if you had trouble with reds. It's something you will get used to after a few days, but it will probably be frustrating at first.

Depending on how you are used to resting your fingers/hand, it may take even longer to adapt.

# ¿ Mar 6, 2022 22:21

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# ¿ May 14, 2024 13:41

Khorne: May 1, 2002

LionArcher posted:

Does anyone on here actually like cherry profile? I�m trying to learn to love it with my Nautilus key caps but it is hard over XDA. I care because all of the best sets are in cherry.

OEM is my favorite but Cherry is usable. I also find it kind of annoying that most sets are in cherry. I've always wondered if it's because it uses significantly less material than OEM or if it's more popular for some other reason that's off my radar like aesthetics or something.

I've never really used XDA but from how it looks I might really like it. I tend to like minimal differences in height between rows, caps that occupy lots of space, and that's about it really. The row height difference criteria is why I prefer OEM over cherry, and XDA seems to take that to an extreme.

Now you have me looking at XDA sets for my upcoming kbd 75 build.

Khorne fucked around with this message at 20:24 on Apr 4, 2022

# ¿ Apr 4, 2022 20:16

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Serious Hardware/Software Crap > Mechanical Keyboards- Justify this please?????

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