US CE Spring 2022: I'm convinced it's useless which is why I argue about it all day every day

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > US CE Spring 2022: I'm convinced it's useless which is why I argue about it all day every day

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cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Sephyr posted:

We've been hearing "The GOP keeps being crazy and putting loons in the spotlight! It'll bite them in the rear end! See if it won't!" pretty much since Newt Gingrich stormed the stage to do jazz hands over Congress, and it has never, ever been true.

poo poo, the GOP apparently gets punished in the polls when they run boring wafflers like Mitt Romney, not hissing gargoyles like Rick Scott, DeSantis, and Trump.

By and large, people didn't really care about 1/6. Material concerns trump everything (no pun intended), even decorum and norms. Things aren't going great in that department, and Dems are perceived as doing little to nothing, which is not inaccurate.

# ¿ Apr 10, 2022 22:48

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# ¿ May 13, 2024 16:02

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

VitalSigns posted:

Macron must have this election in the bag or he wouldn't be confident enough to gently caress over the only demographic that supports him: people old enough to remember the war

I think its more likely that he just didn't fully develop a theory of mind when he was a toddler, which seems to be a common characteristic among neoliberal centrists.

# ¿ Apr 11, 2022 15:10

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Mr Hootington posted:

Yeah and it was zillow.

The housing data pissed off Burry this morning.
https://twitter.com/BurryArchive/status/1513909341019152392?t=aw3vp6F0wA2rVoAi7o923w&s=19

Those formulas are pure sophistry

# ¿ Apr 12, 2022 21:06

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Anybody can wear a dress if they want, jfc. Saying otherwise perpetuates the same stupid gender prescriptivism we're trying to leave behind.

# ¿ Apr 24, 2022 14:50

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

It would have been neat if the Dems took one of the many chances they had codify abortion rights. Obama promised to start pushing the Freedom of Choice act his first day. Never happened.

https://www.foxnews.com/politics/obama-breaks-campaign-promise-to-sign-abortion-bill-immediately

# ¿ May 3, 2022 02:22

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Tnega posted:

Na�ve? Sure. But what does that world look like? You instantly have a circuit split over who is and is not legally married, and if you don't have to accept another state's marriage license, why do you have to accept their driver's license.

Wow sounds bad! Doesn�t mean it won�t happen. Failing empires always succumb to chaos like this.

# ¿ May 3, 2022 15:23

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

BiggerBoat posted:

Anyone have a rough idea on the cross tabs for people that want Roe overturned but are OK with free birth control?

If I had to guess, those who don't like abortion but also think those kind of people have too many kids.

edit:

Mellow Seas posted:

If you don't like Republican appointed judges overturning human rights and still don't see why you have to vote for Democrats, which is literally the only thing that keeps Republicans out of power, then you're the biggest loving idiot in the world and should get hosed, forever, end of discussion, sorry.

Go out in November and vote for Democrats you loving dipshits

Dems had plenty of chances to codify Roe and prevent this, but they didn't. Voting didn't work.

# ¿ May 3, 2022 15:28

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Mellow Seas posted:

No they didn't. You're loving stupid. Vote for Democrats, idiot.

Obama promised to immediately work codify Roe vs. Wade upon entering office, and he had a filibuster-proof majority (even though you really only need 50). Never did. See also the beginning of the Clinton administration. Since you are resorting to base insults on people criticizing Dems, it sounds like you don't have much of an argument.

# ¿ May 3, 2022 15:32

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Mellow Seas posted:

Yes. Vote for Democrats. loving Jesus Christ. You guys think this is some kind of complicated 3D chess match. JUST VOTE FOR THE PARTY THAT DOESN'T OPENLY WANT TO BAN ABORTION.

People did, but it turns out Dems didn't care enough to protect abortion rights. What is your response to that aside from freaking out over people besmirching the name of Pelosi?

# ¿ May 3, 2022 15:34

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Mellow Seas posted:

HELP, REPUBLICANS ARE DESTROYING THE COUNTRY AND THE ONE THING I CAN DO TO HELP, VOTE FOR DEMOCRATS,GIVES ME SADS, SO THERE'S NOTHING I CAN DO EVER, WAAAAH

You loving clowns

Meltdown May is awesome this year. You seem 100x as angry at people being pissed off at Dems than you are at a woman's right to bodily autonomy being destroyed.

(USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)

# ¿ May 3, 2022 15:39

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

TyrantWD posted:

You need 60 votes. Obama had that for 72 days in the middle of the battle over healthcare. Good luck convincing any of the Senators accused of killing grandma to now also vote on a bill codifying Roe vs Wade at the same time.

He didn't even need to have that battle. He just wanted to be ~*bipartisan*~ and so we wound up with watered-down Obamacare. He had plenty of opportunity, but chose not to do it. Why did he make that campaign promise to Planned Parenthood if he wasn't going to at least bring it up for a vote?

# ¿ May 3, 2022 15:50

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

TyrantWD posted:

Why burn up political capital making everyone take a contentious vote that you already know you don't have the numbers for. That is a great way to make people on your side not want to work with you going forward.

How come only Dems have to worry about "political capital?" It never seems to be an issue for the Republicans.

# ¿ May 3, 2022 16:19

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Discendo Vox posted:

You are not the only audience. The existence of other speeches on other topics is not an optics error, except that you are working backward from seeking something to be angry about. As the person I was originally responding to asserted with the idea that Biden simply "decides that this is what actually matters," rather than this being one of the many things scheduled to talk about on a given day, through different means. Other things matter to other audiences than you. If you'd taken the position that Biden should speak more, or earlier, on the subject, it might make sense- demanding that others be dropped doesn't.

Similarly, your inability to understand parallels to previous parts of this discussion does not make you less culpable for the same error, or obligate others to ignore the parallel: you are demanding that the scope of acceptable speech curve entirely around your preferences. Kaine can make statements that appeal to other constituencies, and demanding that he change the scope of his comments to only appeal to yours sets up an impossible, shifting counterfactual by which no particular speech is acceptable.

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Politics, governance, and policy is ultimately about humans. Your analysis on this issue completely fails to recognize this, and completely misses the point that people are trying to make - missing the forest for the trees, as I think I said in a similar situation. Biden should play to people and what they care about, and not do some dumb 17D chess (poorly) that completely ignores people's motivations.

# ¿ May 4, 2022 23:25

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Raskolnikov38 posted:

https://twitter.com/jherrerx/status/1521969506473631744?s=21&t=uV4m1nkVxGcVlwLU_D6H4A

Sure he wants to destroy women's inalienable right to their bodies, but he is polite about it, and that's what really matters. What is the point of having anything to do with these clowns?

# ¿ May 4, 2022 23:46

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

How are u posted:

Yeah, it appears to be a few naked guys goofing around in a very homo-erotic way. One of them is possibly Cauthorn. You don't see anything explicit, but it's certainly not going to play well to his constituents.

Tweet with video is in the GBS thread, for those interested. Judging by how mercilessly and single-mindedly the GOP is knifing Cauthorn, I can only conclude that the drug-fueled group sex parties he was talking about are 100% absolutely bonafide real. He struck the nerve of all nerves, and he's being crucified for it.

The dudes were nude and appeared to at least mime banging. You can't tell whether the bottom is Cawthorn or not, there's just a wheelchair. It is not a good sex tape.

# ¿ May 5, 2022 00:23

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

TGLT posted:

Cawthorne tried to reach for too much without any actual leverage.

So says his cousin.

# ¿ May 5, 2022 00:31

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Nazzadan posted:

Alright I just watched it and if you think that video is in any way indicative of an incestuous gay sex act and not 2 drunk idiots with a third drunk idiot filming them then just lmao

Not directed at anyone here, mostly twitter people

Just totally nude and thrusting into my cousin-bro's face, as a joke. Maybe its different in the South idk.

# ¿ May 5, 2022 01:52

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Ither posted:

I had high hopes for Biden at the beginning of his term.

But he has, so far, absolutely failed to meet the moment.

Good news! You will be able to vote for this billionaire in the 2028 presidential primaries.

# ¿ May 6, 2022 15:24

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

CuddleCryptid posted:

That entirely depend on how you ask the question. Defunding the police is not popular, but all the polls for shifting money from the cops to social programs show strong support.

As with most things like this the slogan was direct and honest but required a small amount of background to understand and therefore was an utter failure at accomplishing it's goals because no one reads below the headline.

More broadly, people really are shaped by the information they consume, and everyone is on a steady diet of capitalist propaganda from a young age - severely limiting the ideas they are exposed to. Overton window etc, etc.

# ¿ May 6, 2022 16:01

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

CuddleCryptid posted:

Yes, but at the same time capitalist propaganda is not the only kind of propaganda there can be. I know that it's not the most glorious thing to say but it's not enough to be right, you have to be both right and compelling, and the propaganda on the side of the anti-cop movement is pretty poor. A lot of people on that side seem to think that appealing to emotion instead of statistics is punching below the belt, which is why they keep losing.

Propaganda needs to be short, catchy, informative of your goals, and only mostly honest.

Yeah, absolutely. It was a failure of the left, although again capital is excellent at suppressing anticapitalist action, so it is hard to do. Most leftists that I see (like me) are reformed liberals that still have some of that internalized decorum/only wanting to talk about hard policy.

# ¿ May 6, 2022 16:10

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Nix Panicus posted:

I'm just not seeing the same energy the George Floyd protests brought yet and I'm having difficulty imagining another Cool Zone summer when the political party in charge of fixing the situation is already trying to throw a wet blanket on direct action.

That strikes me as real bad for anyone hoping for a black swan flood of newly mobilized voters to turn things around.

Also because of the "wedges" or whatever galaxy brain poo poo the consultants are cooking up, they're coming down hard against protests (just Vote!). That would have a strong synergistic effect on turnout, but apparently its more important to avoid offending some "independent" suburbanites.

# ¿ May 10, 2022 14:59

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

Instead of spending millions directly and costing 99% of the population indirectly, you could use that money to just have a more reasonable safety net or invest in other types of manufacturing. Otherwise, you are going to have to require higher and higher tariffs and costs on society to support an ever smaller portion of the population for no reason other than we fetishize factory workers, miners, and farmers.

Agreed, but yet under capitalism, labor-saving automation further immiserates the workers because the surpluses are scooped up by the bourgeosie. We could do what you are saying here, but the interests of those in power will always prevent it.

# ¿ May 11, 2022 15:12

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Lib and let die posted:

The Manchin-Durbin Sinematic cycle

As soon as we replace these 2 3 senators, we'll get abortion protected and everything, for real this time.

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# ¿ May 11, 2022 18:39

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

How are u posted:

Yeah, I think we could.

(announcer) Chris Coons has stepped into the ring.

# ¿ May 11, 2022 18:55

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Archonex posted:

Though i'll say that the modern evangelical is nothing like some of the evangelicals of old. Especially back during the civil war period. Reading up on their history it's shocking how hard times and continual bad choices on the part of their cultural leaders has lead to a movement that is distinctly downright anti-christian in nature in their rejection of empathy towards others.

Good post. Kind of interesting to me how pre late-antique religions didn't really value empathy or moral universalism, but instead had a theology based around power and submission, with accompanying rewards and punishments. The psychological impulses towards that make sense, and but its weird to see strains of Christianity heading right back there.

# ¿ May 12, 2022 15:41

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

ex post facho posted:

reminder that Nance as house leader said "we shouldn't primary Democrat incumbents" and then went on to support a Senate primary for Joe Kennedy against Ed Markey lmao

All Kennedys are incumbents as far as the DNC is concerned.

# ¿ May 12, 2022 19:46

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Harold Fjord posted:

Those people are libertarians who will never vote Dem. Lmao at still trying to court them.

But yet the Dems keep trying this messaging, despite all evidence to the contrary - including recent ones like Virginia.

# ¿ May 12, 2022 20:26

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

selec posted:

https://twitter.com/mgwin46/status/1525095641705336832?s=21&t=jbwKnwomYuRZqyhBsIwjqw

So who does the thread support to primary this ghoul in �24. I think a Draft Fetterman movement might work.

I don't understand how anyone can defend Biden at this point. Pretty amazing to simultaneously encourage defunding a pandemic that is still killing and maiming enormous numbers of Americans, especially poor and minorities, while advocating to increase funding to police forces who oppress and kill those same minorities.

poo poo, I have COVID right now and it loving bites. It would have been neat if there were funding for more boosters and new vaccines targeting variants that actually still exist.

# ¿ May 13, 2022 16:36

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

golden bubble posted:

And its honestly depressing how easy internet leftist can be persuaded not to do the bare minimum. For 50 years, those evil fucks in the anti-abortion movement showed up to vote for anyone who said they would ban abortion. When it seemed like Roe V Wade was settled law, they showed up to vote for their cruel cause. When even conservative justices made public statements that they would not support a total ban, they kept voting. And now, the money and the voting has allowed them to succeed in their evil. Meanwhile, left-wing voter turnout is sad, and regularly gives up after one candidate disappoints them. Do you know how many politicians disappointed the anti-abortion groups for not being evil enough? Hundreds!

The anti-abortion movement is full of stubborn reactionary assholes, and their stubbornness has been rewarded (with evil). Meanwhile, internet doomers can't contribute anything.

Can you give some data about leftist turnout to support your argument? Bernie voters had very high turnout for both Biden and Hillary. We keep getting told to "Vote!" and the vast majority of us have. Yet, the Dems still absolutely poo poo the bed and perpetrate monstrous evils.

# ¿ May 13, 2022 22:21

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

VitalSigns posted:

Weird because when McConnell wanted the COVID relief decoupled from the Ukraine war funding, he called up President Biden and asked him to remove it

Why would McConnell do that when the president has no substantial power over the purse? Someone needs to send McConnell to civics class to learn how government works because he seems to have fallen for a classic piece of propaganda that pretends the president has power over legislation

I love how we get to have these "actually the president only has precisely the formal powers outlined in the constitution" every week or so. The president has a huge control over the purse because he has control over over both how laws are actually enforced, and which legislation gets passed. Power dynamics are real. The govt isn't some sort of beep-boop computer, it's people.

:umberto:

cat botherer fucked around with this message at 15:08 on May 14, 2022

# ¿ May 14, 2022 15:02

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

RBA Starblade posted:

The brunch/dinner divide between liberals and leftists only continues to grow.

There seems to be a definite uptick in liberal hostility towards leftists (not just D&D) since the SCOTUS leak. I guess its just a normal impulse to circle the wagons and try to maintain ideological unity and group cohesion when closely-held beliefs are shown to be false.

# ¿ May 15, 2022 15:58

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

https://twitter.com/RVAwonk/status/1525580947290193921

The Buffalo shooter had a sonnerud (black sun) in his manifesto, a common Nazi symbol used by the neo-nazi Azov battalion. Above is a liberal who supports the Azov battalion and claims their usage is not fascist, despite all observable evidence. Should she be invited to brunch?

These lines are fuzzy, and people hold incoherent beliefs - especially people whose worldview is not moored by materialism.

# ¿ May 15, 2022 16:32

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

CommieGIR posted:

Okay that's not even remotely what that post says, they are simply saying its not unique to Azov battalion.

Yes, and guess what the most prominent group using the sonnerud symbol is?

How are u posted:

Could you cite your metrics or source on this uptick?

My observation. I think many others ITT would concur.

# ¿ May 15, 2022 16:36

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

https://www.jacobinmag.com/2022/04/ukraine-russia-putin-azov-neo-nazis-western-media

Nonwithstanding that Twitter post (its content was supposed to be an example of liberal tolerance of fascism, when convenient), Azov apologia has very much been a thing.

cat botherer fucked around with this message at 17:03 on May 15, 2022

# ¿ May 15, 2022 17:01

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

CommieGIR posted:

That's fine to call that out, but that's not what that twitter post was doing which you were using as an example.

The second tweet says in part, "From the second tweet: I�m sure some Azov Battalion guys have posted stuff with a sonnenrad on it, but the symbol is not an Azov thing; "

To me, this is pretty clearly carrying water for Azov battalion - the Sonnerud is literally in their flag.

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Flag_of_the_Azov_Battalion.svg

edit
To sum up: She said the Sonnenrad is a white supremacist symbol - as such, people who display are usually fascists. She said maybe some guys had stuff with it, which implies she accepted that some Azov guys might be Nazis. Nowhere did she mention it was a Neo-Nazi battalion, despite everything about them. So, this is pretty clearly a dog-whistly, wishy-washy defense of Azov.

cat botherer fucked around with this message at 17:17 on May 15, 2022

# ¿ May 15, 2022 17:12

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

ImpAtom posted:

Who said that? I don't see anyone saying *anything* more 'forgiving' than 'that is a white supremacists symbol, not exclusively an Azov symbol,

Using Azov and Ukraine interchangeably is not a really valid or truthful.

No one has done this. Everyone has used the word "Azov" and has not conflated the two. Everyone condemns the invasion. However, not everyone supports the liberal blob consensus on what the appropriate action is. Many of us remember innumerable other times we attempted to "help" militarily.

I have a hard time seeing this any other way than a bad-faith attempt to misconstrue the point of leftists in this thread - not that the mods care (one of which contributed to the dogpile but has since become silent).

cat botherer fucked around with this message at 22:36 on May 15, 2022

# ¿ May 15, 2022 22:32

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

PeterCat posted:

It amazes me how many ACAB leftists' view on Ukraine seems to be "stop resisting!"

I never hear calls of "Russia should just withdraw from Ukraine," it's always "Ukraine should top resisting and other countries should stop supporting Ukraine because it will just prolong the war. Also, Ukrainians are Nazis."

Once again, totally misconstruing what I and others said, and also demeaning the views of many people who are fighting for things like racial justice. Many bad things happen, and our "help" has a track record of making things worse. An recent example of us trying to help the good guys that went south was Libya. Another one was arming the Mujahadeen. Another example would be Syria.

Yet another example would be Iraq. The liberal consensus at the time supported toppling Saddam, because he was a ruthless and horrible dictator (true), but also because because they bought into a convenient narrative that he had something to do with 9/11 and had WMDs (false). Leftists warned strongly against this at the time, but were roundly shouted down. The conflict, and those that spiraled out of it (like Syria) have killed over a million people.

Many leftists (including me) now think that throwing more weapons into Ukraine (some of which will wind up in the hands of the Azov battalion) is not prudent. The unknowns are huge and highly dynamic, and as such the risk is high. Sometimes the immediately appealing option may not be the best one, and we should think carefully how similar situations in the past have panned out. This also wraps back into domestic policy, because this is being used by Biden as a justification to discontinue much COVID funding.

cat botherer fucked around with this message at 23:25 on May 15, 2022

# ¿ May 15, 2022 23:21

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

PeterCat posted:

Unless I'm mistaken, the liberal view of gun control is that firearms are appropriate for the military to have to wage war with, but not for the average citizen to have private ownership of. Supplying the Ukrainian military is not the same thing as imagining some kind of popular uprising with your AR-15.

We have a consistent track record of our arms aid going to militia groups that we don�t intend. The latest example would be all of the arms that wound up in the hands of the Taliban. What reasoning do you have to discount that possibility here?

# ¿ May 16, 2022 00:45

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Doctor Teeth posted:

https://www.businessinsider.com/russia-fighter-neo-nazi-symbols-medal-kill-ukraine-nationalist-2022-4

Ah, so both sides have Nazis. Probably shouldn�t give any of them guns then!

edit: A broader point is that US foreign policy consensus and liberal opinion tends towards �good guy/bad guy� narratives, and we all want to help the good guys. It�s never that simple, and we would do well to remember that before Kramering in to another conflict.

cat botherer fucked around with this message at 00:51 on May 16, 2022

# ¿ May 16, 2022 00:47

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# ¿ May 13, 2024 16:02

cat botherer: Jan 6, 2022; I am interested in most phases of data processing.

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

Congress is having Pentagon officials testify under oath about UFOs (now called UAPs) for the first time since the 1960's.

So far, nothing too exciting.

- They have been able to identify about half of all UFO/UAP sightings in the last 20 years, but have no explanation for the other half.

- No evidence at all they are extraterrestrial.

- Most likely explanations are advanced drone prototypes.

- Treating it as a national security issue now; although a minor one. For too long nobody really looked deeply into them because of the joke factor of UFOs.

So they think they are advanced drone prototypes from China (or Russia). These have unknown propulsion, are capable of accelerating and decelerating from hypersonic speeds and diving into the water. But this is not a big deal for national security. It's fine to have multi-century technology gaps with your adversaries. Also, the Chinese have apparently had this technology since the 1940s.

vvv There's very credible evidence for these sightings - observed simultaneously by pilot eyesight, ship radar, and fighter radar. There's been a lot of consistency too of different kinds (saucers, tic-tacs, black triangles). There's a point where you have to accept its something real, whatever it is. It's also not just the US. This stuff happens all over the world.

Also, since they also have been observed diving, UAP is the better nomenclature, because it is a wet-rear end phenomena.

cat botherer fucked around with this message at 14:59 on May 17, 2022

# ¿ May 17, 2022 14:51

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > US CE Spring 2022: I'm convinced it's useless which is why I argue about it all day every day

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