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Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Color me surprised . Youngkin is an inflamed anal fistula who spends all day trying to figure out a new way to get the attention of Trumpu Sempai.

Dude should go play in traffic.

In Mariupol.

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Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Since hurf durf I’m the governor do what I say I’m basically a king make Virginia great again.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

The thing is I'd absolutely believe it if the Young Jeff story was a real thing, but it doesn't mean he's not a Lex Luthor parody who treats people like consumables now.

Getting mega wealthy changes people and removes them from the kind of poo poo that makes them treat other people with a scrap of empathy.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

bobjr posted:

I’m pretty sure if they took away individual trash bins a good 40-50% of the people I work with will just let trash pile up at their workstation until someone else picks it up.

The answer to this poo poo is to just pile your garbage in the corner next to the door until they give you your loving trash cans back.

Pile it in front of your boss's office door if you're brave and your work doesn't have internal cameras.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Yorkshire Pudding posted:

Yeah I told her “intent is irrelevant, if it’s making you uncomfortable it’s harassment”. But like I said, she has pretty bad anxiety and is worried she’ll get written off or be seen as a troublemaker or something. I told her to tell her supervisor and if he didn’t handle it immediately to go straight to HR with all the messages, including the ones to show that she told multiple people about it with no effect.

She's not wrong, that poo poo happens. It's happened to people in my family where they basically became "that bitch" in the office until they left.

That said, the answer isn't to just sit there and take it, the answer is to tell them and if they do nothing about it (or, worse, retaliate or the like) quit and find a new job. It sucks but at the end of the day it's way, WAY better to be looking for new work than to be working at the kind of place that tolerates that behavior.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Hyrax Attack! posted:

Most depts at my MegaCorp are informal about hierarchy and I'll get emails from directors or VPs for requests. But HR is weirdly the most attached to their org chart and a director will have a subordinate email us short requests rather than do it themselves. HR seems terrified of anyone higher up in the food chain, because if this tiny request isn't completed ASAP a VP could get an unneeded email! (VP is mellow and unaware of the issue)

There's a gently caress off big quarterly report I build from information submitted by all the different parts of my organization. The sort of thing where I've got an email list for all the department heads (or the person they delegated this to - it's kinda poo poo work) and everyone just builds out their info with whatever internal methods they use, and then send it along to me. Everyone does it a little different but for the most part it looks like this:

1) I email the head of the Department of Widgets.
2) They say "OK, I'll get it in"
3) Magic happens
4) Department of Widgets info shows up in my in-box with plenty of time for me to put together the report before it's due.

The one completely insane outlier is HR. Frankly they shouldn't even be on this report but I guess they felt left out. Their department head insists on micromanaging everything, so all communication flows through them, but also insists that everything get signed off on like two levels above them. They're roping director level people in on this crap who frankly shouldn't be bothered.

So with them it goes:

1) I email the head of HR, saying I need their stuff.
2) my email gets forwarded to their underling.
3) underling #1 forwards it to the person below them.
4) repeat for few more steps. I'm CC'd on all this.
5) eventually the poo poo trickles far enough down-hill that it lands on the desk of someone who has to actually do it. But I'm not allowed to communicate directly with this person. I did that once and the head of HR blew their stack at my boss. So when there's some issue (and there always is because it gets delegated so junior that frequently it's a new person doing the numbers every quarter because the last one quit or got moved up a peg or whatever) repeat steps 2-5 in both directions as they telephone game their queries to me and then send down my response.
6) eventually the report gets put together. Do I get it now? No, head of HR sends it to their boss for approval, who sends it to their boss for approval. No one else in the entire org is having this poo poo reviewed at that kind of level. The people involved are very busy (either for real or executive level "busy") so inevitably it takes for loving ever to get this wrangled.
6a) if there are any questions or concerns repeat the idiotic telephone game I described in step 5.
7) eventually I'm staring down needing to submit this report incomplete or get an extension for it to be late because HR's boss's boss has had it for a week or whatever and hasn't given it their blessing yet.
8) I go to my boss (who is at the same org chart level as the head of HR). If there's any other part of the org that's tardy he just goes and talks to the head of the Widget Department because they're peers and says "yo, get my guy the poo poo he needs" and it happens. But no, since this crap is being sent two levels up by HR he needs to get HIS boss on the horn and sometimes his boss's boss so we can finally find someone senior enough to tell HR's boss's boss to just loving rubber stamp that poo poo like they did last quarter.
9) inevitably it finally comes back to me and it's a loving mess and I spend the next three business days frantically doing back-channel totally unauthorized and semi-secret talks with whatever bottom rung had to throw this bullshit together to get it un-hosed. While I'm at it I explain what they need to do next time which is almost always futile, because again there's such high turn over there that I think I've only had the same person for two quarters in a row once in like three years.

And, let me again emphasize as hard as I can: there is no loving reason for HR to be in this report. It has to do with compliance on poo poo that HR never comes close to touching, but at some point in the past they felt left out. The poo poo they're reporting is nigh nonsensical for the purpose of the report and would really be more at home in a quarterly management briefing which, let me again emphasize, this report is not.

Goddamn.

Cyrano4747 fucked around with this message at 17:48 on May 18, 2022

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

WonkyBob posted:

Could you not attach whatever HR sends as well as the report and just say "this additional info is unimportant"?

Nope. Deciding what to put in or not is way above my pay grade, and for better or worse HR's got their little dog and pony show included.

My boss and I are working to try and overhaul the whole thing in the coming FY but it's one of those deals where we need to put our ducks in a row just so in order to demonstrate the need and then get buy in from the people who need to approve it etc.

Part of the larger problem is that way back in the mists of time some eager beavers expanded the report out incrementally. What started as something to make sure we stayed compliant with some industry things slowly broadened out to this thing where everyone wants to show what they're doing and get a pat on the back from the way higher ups for not sucking. Part of any overhaul is going to be trimming that hedge back significantly, but there's probably going to be a fight. It might involve setting up another general management review or something for department heads to toot their horn in, but at that point my attitude is not my pig, not my farm.

Unless somehow it lands on my desk alongside the current report in which case :suicide:

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Methylethylaldehyde posted:

Sadly, bitching about it here and enjoying a beer is probably about the most productive thing he can do in the immediate term.

Well, that and the ongoing job search.

It's gonna be loving hilarious when I do jump because lol they put way too much responsibility on me. My boss has said more than once that he's hosed on that quarterly report in particular if I ever leave.

(edit: he's a good boss, and is constantly pointing me towards positions both internal and external. I have a strong feeling he's looking for the door too)

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Non Krampus Mentis posted:

To sum up:

Got covid, was out for almost two weeks.
Came back to discover Assault Baker has had some kind of negative interaction with literally everyone on staff (and that our overnight person, whose shifts would have overlapped with hers, quit very suddenly while I was gone).
Also boss is leaving for a wedding from the 2nd to the 11th and has announced that the person in charge of back of house operations for that time will be… Assault Baker.

lmao my boss is going to lose the entire crew because she can’t discipline one rear end in a top hat

You are looking for new jobs, right?

Because I binged most of this thread over a few weeks a bit back when I was sick with covid myself and it was kind of wild seeing you paint this elaborate picture of the bakery from hell over the course of months of posting.

I don't think this place is salvageable. I get that you likely aren't in a position to be able to just quit, but you should be applying with pretty much anyone who will take a resume at this point.

edit: ^^^^ staging a walkout would be fun, but they already had a huge staff meeting with employee demands etc. At the end of the day small business like this can have owners/management that are just pig headedly resistant to change, and after a certain point no amount of organizing is going to unfuck a business that is someone's personal fiefdom. The answer is to find another job and laugh from the sidelines as everyone else does and the business fails. Like, that's the pro-business argument for unions: they help you retain staff by making your workplace not suck which in turn helps you stay in business.

Sometimes you just gotta get out. The last thing you want to do is be one of the last holdouts still working at the lovely business when it finally goes under.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Escape From Noise posted:

Yeah, I've had to work for psmall places that cannot get their poo poo together at all. Best bet is finding something else if you can, although I realize that's often easier said than done. Good luck!

The nice thing about recognizing that your workplace is hosed is that you can start looking for work while still drawing a paycheck from them. So not only are you not flat on your rear end financially while between jobs, but you're also not so desperate for a new position that you'll take literally anything on offer just to pay the rent.

edit: I mean, always be looking for work even if your current job is fine. You might find something better. You might get an offer that you can leverage to getting paid more where you are. Or you might end up with a better job even if your current one is OK enough that you can keep doing it.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Outrail posted:

well, yeah fair point.

If the business is that bad and toxic it'd be better to have everyone quit at once and absolutely tank the company so it goes under and no-one else will be hurt when they keep hiring one employee after another as it death spirals over the next year or two.

The other possibility is that could be the final straw that prompts the firing of the major cause of problems, but seems unlikely at this point.

You're not wrong about it being better if poo poo companies don't hire more people, but the problem with this is that it requires coordinating quitting with everyone, which means that most people aren't going to have new jobs lined up at exactly that time.

Basically people need to be in a situation where they can swing unemployment while they look for new work. From the individual's perspective it's better to look for work while still holding that job, find a new position, and quit the second you land your new job.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

OPAONI posted:

I want a gneiss countertop.

I want a two-tone gneiss countertop with a 69 inlaid on it.

Honestly if I can get that I'll probably die happy of meme countertop overload.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

tired gay and dead posted:

You could probably get that made pretty easily if you got the money to burn.

I mean, I could probably theoretically afford it. If it was just me and I decided I wanted to spend grown up money on a stupid childish joke.

The problem is I have a wife and I really don't know how I'd get her onboard.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Escape From Noise posted:

Might be time to go back to teaching English.

Jesus, I've done that (Korea not Japan though) and if you're looking at going back to that poo poo things must be bad

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

YeahTubaMike posted:

I'm sorry if I missed this, but does anyone else work at a company where they hired waves and waves of new people so it ended up that there were whole departments of people who had -- at most -- 4-ish months of experience?

Currently I work at a company where there are four QA people on my team (myself included) -- my boss has a year of experience being a boss altogether, today is my two-month-iversary, and the other QA people got hired like three weeks ago. THEY'RE asking ME for help, and it feels very "blind leading the blind"-y.

There's also the fact that onboarding took about a month, and part 1 was for marketing-centric, and part 2 was dev-centric, so I spent about a month learning very little that would actually help me do my own job.

This is going to be my wife's company in about six months, but not because they're trying to expand. They haven't been able to retain for poo poo and everyone is throwing applications out and heading for the door. Meanwhile they're not hiring to replace for basically the same reasons they aren't retaining - compensation for the most part, but there are a few other issues as well.

They're a subsidiary of a bigger megacorp and megacorp policies are dictating how their compensation and other benefits are working, only megacorp and her corp are in related but not quite the same industries. Result: saying you can't give raises for like 3 years drives people out the door, and saying you can only hire people at about 80% of what they'll get at the competition means you have trouble bringing in new hires.

My prediction is that once they literally can't do their jobs any more due to a lack of people (they're getting loving close) megacorp will backtrack the pay policy and they'll have an entire crop of fresh faces who don't know their jobs nearly as well as the people they had a couple years back and who are now working for their direct competition.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Escape From Noise posted:

My cousin's boss would apparently go apeshit when his printer ran out of ink and would literally throw it out a second story window. She had some insane stories from working in that law firm, yet her parents were really disappointed with her for not sticking it out with the crazy lawyer who thought you could click hyperlinks on a printed piece of paper.

Small business owners are a special kind of insane, and lawyers and doctors with their own independent practices 100% count as small business owners. '

The two most psycho bosses I ever had were small business owners. It's just a toxic combination of success making them completely confident in the infallibility of their own decisions, along with absolute control and authority over everything they touch.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Johnny Truant posted:

^^^^^ it's regulated by states, there's no federal PTO payout guidelines

Use it all up then don't show up afterwards :balldo:

I had an old coworker do that. Company was going to pay out PTO at 1/2, so he got a 2 week vacation approved to use up most, if not all of it, then the day before it started put in his 2 week notice.

A few jobs ago I hadd a joint PTO/sick time thing. IIRC it was something like 5 hours per paycheck of PTO accrual, which came out to ~3 weeks of PTO. Not terrible, but again, sick time comes out of it so you really need to save it and have some left over at the end of the year in case you get the flu or get in a car crash or whatever.

Eventually we all got this big notice in October or November that they weren't letting us roll over more than 80 hours of PTO any more. Guess who had close to 200 banked? Guess who had a huge as gently caress end-of-year thing he had to work on, including a huge as poo poo client meeting he had to be active in? Guess who got denied to roll over his PTO for a couple of months so he could burn it in the spring?

Guess who took gently caress near a month off right when all that critical poo poo was going down because it was use it or loose it and lol I'm not working for free?

It was so loving stupid, all they had to do was approve me to temporarily roll over that PTO for like a month, and I could have taken my extended bout of playing video games in my living room during the post-year-end-clusterfuck slack time. As it was I came in for like 3 or 4 days to do really critical stuff and then went back to loving off, but holy poo poo literally all they had to do was get HR to let me kick that can for a single goddamned month. Maybe it was my supervisor? Or the company owner/head (small business so that's always an option)? No idea, all I know is I got told no.

Also made the client I was working for extremely unhappy with the company because I made sure to tell them that this vacation time wasn't exactly my choice, and they were extremely understanding on my "I don't work for free" policy.

I also got a super lovely email from my manager about how if I "pulled something like this again" they just wouldn't approve the leave and basically force me to burn it, which is a big part of why I don't work there any more.

edit: later found out through the grape vine that they lost the contract on it's next re-up cycle, and god I hope it was because of that mess :allears:

edit 2: same idiots also hosed everyone's 401k contributions really badly. Like, REALLY badly as in deducted our contributions but then didn't pay it into the plans. For almost a year. That was fun to un-gently caress. The real question (still unanswered) was if it was fraud, serious cash-flow problems with the business, or the staggering incompetence of the owner's family member who was responsible for handling that poo poo.

God I'm glad I don't work there any more.

Cyrano4747 fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Jun 1, 2022

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Barudak posted:

Don't wait for her to return for the two weeks notice

Yeah that sounds like something that is the responsibility of the new FOH guy while she's out of town.

Just gtfo.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Samuel L. Hacksaw posted:

I've learned (from DMing for tabletop games) that asking, 'well, what is it you would like to do? ' works pretty well, then you just repeat back to them what they asked for with small changes until they accidentally compromise.

You can't roll to gently caress the dragon, but you can roll to calm it!

Dumb poo poo your work does - You can't roll to gently caress the dragon, but you can roll to calm it!

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Sounds like it's time to find another job, since they cut your compensation pretty significantly.

I mean, don't need to quit tomorrow, keep drawing a paycheck while you job hunt, but gently caress knows in your shoes I'd be shooting off resumes everywhere .

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Lazyfire posted:


One thing I've learned is that he thinks our insurance is good and he's being compensated "pretty well." I told him how I used to pay $70 a month for my wife and myself to have no copays, no co-insurance and a $1000 deductible and it blew his mind. I know he came in near the bottom of the payscale for the job, which means he's making nearly nothing for a fairly demanding job (in a fully remote office job, so "nearly nothing" is still way above the median income in the US). The next generation of workers is coming into a reality I watched transform, so I feel like it's a requirement that I tell this guy things used to be better and corporate greed ruined it so he'll learn not to have company loyalty either.

This isn't even all that new. I'm an old millennial and I've never, ever had anything other than high deductible plans.

My general plan is not to get sick, and when I do have problems I kick the can on getting them treated until I've got enough bundled together to exceed the deductible. Not the best plan but whelp.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

yeah, hipaa applies to health care providers and insurance companies and maybe people with privileged access like HR, not to random people discussing other people's health.

There would probably be some kind of argument if, for example, HR was publicly posting a list of people who had been vaccinated. This is just them trying to avoid drama in the office. Which is itself them trying to avoid people having important yet uncomfortable discussions about matters that directly affect them by throwing it under the headline of "drama."

You know, kind of like they also do with discouraging employees from discussing compensation with each other.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Pyrtanis posted:

Hospitals seem to also do this, SA was blocked for "questionable content" but Reddit was wide open. I figured it was the IT department, as the C-suite is always full of ex nurses and olds.

Airports do the same thing. I've seen SA blocked on airport wifi for "drugs" "weapons" "terrorism" (lol) "obscene content" and I'm sure others but that's what I've got off the top of my head.

Meanwhile i would be able to go to dedicated gun forums and reddit seemed to be wide open.

I suspect that SA got on some block list back in the early 00s and that everyone just recycles the same list of naughty websites. If it's even semi-obscure (like a forum for people collecting WW2 rifles) or mainstream as gently caress (reddit) you'll see the filters hit it less often.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Escape From Noise posted:

Yeah. I don't think they get it although the "do crazy poo poo" directive has slowed down a bit. I think doing experimental stuff every so often is a good idea, but you definitely need your bread and butter beers. We'll see. I also just hate pastry stouts and lactose beers in general. I'll do what I'm asked, but with something like an imperial stout that's so much time and effort, I'd like to make something less crazy.

What's the go-to beer for your average Japanese person eating in a restaurant? Why not just make one of those as your "house special" and then have some more unique stuff on tap for the more adventurous people?

I'm just a humble beer drinker but that seems to be what every microbrewery in the US does. Each one will have their little thing or specialty, but they've all got some variation of a pilsner and some take on an IPA for someone to downshift to who isn't all about their main theme.

edit: to be clear, I'm curious what your boss' stated reason for not doing this is. This is kind of obvious and I assume that the galaxy brained idea of "why not make beer that is locally popular" already occurred to you

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

A lot of the legacy software that straight up requires it is also just that - legacy software that people really, really don't want to pay to replace. I've seen this in .mil, .gov. and regular 'ol commercial settings.

Especially in the military and government world you're sometimes talking about a custom implementation of a piece of software that was spun up specifically for them anywhere from 10-20 years ago, and which replacing will require a whole acquisitions process. Even setting aside the monetary costs, the paperwork involved with finding a new vendor can be burdensome, and that's ignoring the actual operational issues with transitioning from Old Broke IE Dependent System A to New Hotness System B.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Ichabod Sexbeast posted:

Make an ice cream porter

Nah, make a porter ice cream.

As in ice cream out of porter.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

champagne posting posted:

are you in a terrible prison?

They already said they work.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Lol sitting in a hotel lobby.

Lady across from me is doing interviews remotely. Just heard her getting off call with someone, talking about looking at the person’s linked in and saying they’d email the background check later today.

Then she hops on another call (phone not computer) with I presume her boss or what ever and says she doesn’t think this candidate is a good fit. Why? She wasn’t dressed well enough and had “white trash makeup” whatever that means.

I mean I couldn’t see the screen for all I know someone showed up to interview in ICP face paint. But still lol at just loving saying it out loud like that.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

TITTIEKISSER69 posted:

I do IT in an executive search firm and I'd love to know if this was someone in my company.

No idea who she works for. Non descript dell laptop, don’t see any corporate badging on her stuff.

She’s going on vacation in a few hours and needs to bust these interviews before her flight, I can tell you that much.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

It was 11:30 or noon or so so I assume she was waiting on her room to get ready, same as me

In fairness I’m also working in the lobby but that only involves a hotspot and spreadsheets for me.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Thomamelas posted:

I have no issue with people working in a hotel lobby. My job pre-pandemic was 75% travel. Someone working quietly in a lobby is fine. But conducting interviews there just seems deeply disrespectful.

If I was on the hiring side of the equation I would agree with you just out of an abundance of caution.

As an applicant? As long as it’s not a sensitive interview (e.g. discussing PII etc) I kinda don’t care. But, again, that’s just me.

I would hope her background game is on point though.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Tezer posted:

My work is refreshing the employee manual and added a policy that is pretty clearly against NLRB guidance regarding the right of employees to discuss compensation with each other. I mentioned that they probably wanted to pull it, since (my limited understanding) is that even having the policy is a violation of the NLRA even if the policy not enforced.

Apparently they hired an HR consultant who told them to add that statement and the consultant's response to my concern (it got forwarded to them) was 'oh, that must be something Obama did'.

Dumb poo poo your work does - Oh, that must be something Obama did

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Escape From Noise posted:

I think helles and lemonade (European lemonade, so lemon soda to Americans) and hefeweissen with lemonade is a Ruß. Hefeweissen with coke is a slur. Or was.

Most people just call it a Colaweizen now.

I mean, it's gross and it shouldn't exist anyways, but if you're a gross person who insists on ruining a good heff by dumping loving coke in it, there's a way to ask for someone to do that without saying something that makes you sound like you're in 1930s Germany.

edit: and a light beer + lemonade is a Radler.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Escape From Noise posted:

Yeah..I thought the old coke weissen name was probably old at this point.

I''m not gonna lie, when it's hot out a light lager and limeade really does it for me.

Apfelschorle and wine is my go-to for that. Apfelschorle is basically half and half apple juice and carbonated mineral water, and then you half-and-half that with white wine and it is INCREDIBLY refreshing while still putting enough alcohol in you that you'll catch a buzz after a couple pints.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Neito posted:

I think it's a few things.

1) As was mentioned before, the whole "How am I supposed to be lord of all I survey if I step out of my office and there's nobody there diligently trying to look busy in front of me so I don't fire them?"

2) People who only had a social life because of forced work interaction suddenly finding themselves lonely.

3) The (false) impression that the Great Resignation is over and they can go back to bullying people to act how they want because they don't have a choice.

4) I base this on very little, but basically the idea that a lot of people do want a Return to Office, but are being bullied/pressured/are the silent majority compared to a handful of complainers.

5) a persistent belief that you can't trust your workers and they will slack off every chance they get. See also: why cubicles have those low walls anyone standing up can see over, and why actual offices are reserved for the trusted managers. Of course the actual productivity of offices during WFH generally disprove this.

Ignored in all of it is the fact that people just don't work effectively like robots, hammering away for 8 hours straight until the whistle sounds, and even in-office work has a FUCKLOAD of slack time where people are chatting with their neighbors or loving with their phones or browsing the internet on their work computer etc.

There's also 6) the argument that spontaneous interaction with co-workers spurs cooperative collaboration and good ideas. This is the one that I'll kind of grant for specific industries. I could see a silicon valley office maybe working better as people bounce ideas off each other, but then again in my non-techie experience people do that plenty well via text chat and video calls too.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

BigHead posted:

A boomer at my org today announced he has held up a big project for several months because when he copy pasted an email address to an external partner, he included the period at the end of the sentence. Like "smith@yahoo.com." Including that period over and over and over, until he finally called IT to "fix" it for him. He has been getting "undeliverable" messages but he hadn't thought they were important. We have been operating under the assumption that the external partner has been avoiding and ignoring us since March. Nope, just this rear end in a top hat can't figure out email.

\/\/ His literal words were "I copied an extra period and the Outlook didn't like it."

I have a TINY amount of sympathy for this. I mean, I believe you that this person has terminal boomer brain and they're just bad at email and don't get that the bounced message is an indication they hosed up. But in my current position I've got a gigantic hell mailing list for this quarterly clusterfuck I'm responsible for. The frequency of emails is in that awkward spot where it's infrequent enough that people are getting added or leaving between messages all the time, but often enough that you need an actual list.

Of course that list isn't maintained well. I do what I can with constantly adding in people when I'm told that Bob just got hired into the Department Of Widget Integration and needs to be getting these emails, but when Carol from Widget Resources retires it might be a year or more before I find out. This is complicated by the various contractors and other less than permanent staff that sometimes get in on it. Or people who move laterally within the organization and their new responsibilities either do or don't require them to get this email. And it's a gently caress-off huge list, too. Over 100 people at one point, although it's been pruned a bit since then.

Which means that every time I have to send one of these blasts my in-box gets bombarded by a loving cacophony of OOO responses, auto-responses, and inevitably a few "undeliverable" messages in the mix. I do my best to prune those out when I see them, but it's frankly a low priority item for me given my other responsibilities.

I dunno, your person sounds like an idiot but just reading about undeliverable notices kinda triggers me.

The real answer to all this would be to un-gently caress how these semi-quarterly things are sent out, maybe even *gasp* have a special email box just for it so it's not coming from Cyrano@organization.biz and loving up the rest of my inbox, and maybe even do something really radical like just set up a loving internal page to post this information on rather than blasting it out into people's emails. I mean, I know for a fact that most of the people who get this don't actually want it.

But this is how someone authorized it to be done in the mists of time (I no bullshit think I heard the late 90s as an actual origin date once) and changing things would be :effort: so :shrug:

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Domus posted:

I got my desired 1.50, and an apology for the initial lowball offer.. I should have gone for more but I can hang on to this job while I look for another. I’m kind of stunned at how quickly they went from raises being 4 percent max to oh poo poo we need you don’t go away. Thanks everyone for the moral support. It let me know that I wasn’t crazy in being offended by that offer.

Keep looking anyway.

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

It’s all dependent on how much you’re getting paid.

If I’m clearing $250k I’m going to have a lot more room in my life for poo poo like bathroom break scheduling than if I’m getting $25k.

Edit: that said the low end is what always gets ducked. Unless it s a hard requirement if the job like that machine example above not having draconian, dumb rules is an easy way to attract talent beyond pay. I’d happily take 225k and work in a chill office instead of 250 in an awful one. It’s the jobs that feel like you need them more than they need you that pull that poo poo.

Cyrano4747 fucked around with this message at 14:26 on Aug 18, 2022

Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Yeah if I ever get called in by a boss and asked to read a thing and sign off that I read it I’m reading it CAREFULLY, twice, and asking for a copy of it on the way out.

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Cyrano4747
Sep 25, 2006

Yes, I know I'm old, get off my fucking lawn so I can yell at these clouds.

Lazyfire posted:


Then the guy coordinating my wife and my move for her job suggested, multiple times in one email, I was planning to divorce her and claim spousal support before he realized I was responding from a company account as well.

What the gently caress?

What's the context of this? Just some dude trying to gaslight your wife into thinking you're going to dump her? Why the gently caress would someone do this?

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