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uPen posted:Here's something I've never seen before, my culture naturally grabbing a 4th circle luxury over 3rd ring food sources, weird. I'm betting it's because of the forest, natural expansion greatly favors flat land before forests or hills.
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Jul 9, 2013 05:34
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uPen posted:It also passed up 4 fish hexes for that elephant. I have sailing and no trapping. Border expansion also greatly favors land tiles over water tiles. I believe water expansion becomes more frequent once you get a Lighthouse, but I haven't tested/paid enough attention to be sure. Alkydere posted:So started my new game, playing as Arabia to buck the trend and let everyone else try out Venice first. Rush-buy a Granary and watch that city become a monster. 
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Jul 9, 2013 05:52
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Alkydere posted:Normally, I'd say on the hill for the production bonus and such. In fact I'm still tempted. Yet at the same time, with that perfect ring of 5 floodplain wheat and 1 sheep with a blank spot in the middle it's hard to resist filling up the empty floodplain. With all the fog still around it's hard to be sure where the best spot is, but settling in that empty patch is perfect access to all the visible resources. If you settle on the hill, that's going to push a lot of it further out and bottleneck your growth according to how fast your borders can expand. Settling on the flood plain also allows three pastures instead of two, which makes Stables more attractive as an investment (plus the +1 food at Fertilizers, IIRC). The usual question of short-term gains versus long-term benefits. Unless you're worried about early rushes (i.e. you're on a high difficulty level), I'd say go with the flood plain. With the way the rivers and hills are laid out, you have a very defensible area with a standard archer army.
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Jul 9, 2013 06:03
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jtm33 posted:I don't really care much about having to wait a while for my key from GMG but it makes me wonder what the hell is the point in pre-ordering if you don't get the game as soon as it is released. I was under the impression that getting it the moment it was released is THE point of pre-ordering. Getting the game at 2/3rds price? 
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Jul 9, 2013 06:08
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Necroneocon posted:I agree. It's also weird to see people here (and the other forums) sticking up for businesses/corporations instead of other people and customers like themselves. People on those forums are upset and annoyed and are just letting out their frustration. While I'm not happy that I don't have my key immediately, I know better than to blame GMG when it's clearly not their fault. None of the other third-party distributors have keys either, so it's definitely 2K dropping the ball.
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Jul 9, 2013 06:25
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RagnarokAngel posted:Nobody is "dropping the ball". Steam very often doesnt release games until noon Pacfic time, this is an exception rather than a rule, and many companies dont email their keys out at Midnight Eastern time. This is being very presumptious and they haven't voided their agreement until it's 12:00 on the 10th. I'm assuming that Steam isn't acting as a key broker - they'll generate keys and handle their redemption (and manage sales to individual consumers), but it's 2K who requests additional keys for wholesale to third party distributors. Therefore, the responsibility lies on 2K to ensure that the keys they requested for resale are delivered. If somehow Steam is acting as the broker (which seems like a bad idea from multiple standpoints to me), then it's still not GMG's fault, it's Steam's fault for not delivering keys in preparation for when the game goes live (unless it's 2K's fault again for not specifying to send it to resellers a little early). If somehow the keys have already been sent but simply not processed to allow sending to customers, then I wonder what the hell is going on that multiple companies whose entire business revolves around reselling digital products and their associated keys cannot automate the process and have it done within the hour. Maybe one company hosed up, but Occam's Razor says the problem is elsewhere when it's two or three.
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Jul 9, 2013 06:44
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Alkydere posted:Welp, I think this game is lost. Suleimon was postering aggressively but I was confident that I had enough composites to hold him off. Man, the Terracotta Army sounds like a warmonger's favorite wonder now. Does it also duplicate the promotions your units have? Can you ruins-upgrade a duplicate of an already upgraded unit?
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Jul 9, 2013 07:51
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impression from sheer mass.
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Jedi Knight Luigi posted:Well this doesn't look good: Is he an official company representative or just a volunteer moderator? If the latter, there's not much more he can say.
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Jul 9, 2013 07:56
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splifyphus posted:Not doing so well in my game, I've lost out on a bunch of key tourism wonders. Buildings with multiple slots are a huge loving deal,especially for Napoleon. I rushed to a great Petra location, only to discover that Petra isn't as great as it used to be. I also missed out on a religion, simply because there is so, so much poo poo to deal with at the beginning of the game now. I tried watching and the stream flickers like mad, but even worse I don't know what your game plan is so it seems like all your unit movements and production is random and it's maddening. 
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Jul 9, 2013 09:35
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Got my key as well. There's a post from someone who seems to be on the GMG staff:quote:Hi all - keys are currently being sent out for Civ V: Brave New World in North America. We did not receive clearance to send these from the publisher before it was opened up for download on Steam. We have to wait for publisher clearance and in this instance we sadly did not hear from them in time. We'd like to apologise for any inconvenience caused by this, and rest assured keys are going out now.
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Jul 9, 2013 09:59
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Steve2911 posted:I take it there's no chance of GMG sending out keys to UK customers until the 12th? Not looking good. GMG Employee posted:Re: EU release, hopefully before the release date but ultimately it's down to 2K telling us when we're cleared to send them out.
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Jul 9, 2013 11:02
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Well, it seems clear that my standard openings are shot and that I'm going to have to relearn my early game strategies. Cash is weirdly valuable yet unimportant because you can't get enough to afford anything in the beginning, and the AI loving loves religion now - I dropped myself down to a lower difficulty and I've still never seen them go so fast. Culture feels a little bit easier to get, probably because of the new Great Works stuff. Early caravans seem kinda meh - the gold they generate isn't particularly good considering how easy it is for them to die. Haven't messed with food or hammer caravans yet to see how that turns out. Could be a nice way to get those fresh border cities up and running without relying on rush-buying.
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Jul 9, 2013 12:47
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Randler posted:Does Brave New World improve performance in any way? Vanilla Civilization V as well as Gods & Kings needed an annoying amount of time to process turns for me after the mid-game. Turn times were significantly improved with the last patch, which was just before BNW released.
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Jul 9, 2013 22:08
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RagnarokAngel posted:Seriously having your spies set up a heist to steal a piece of art is so obvious it's weird they didnt do it by default. I think the inability to acquire new works except through Great People or conquest is supposed to be a balancing factor, otherwise it becomes a little too easy to control tourism. And given how frequent tech steals are.... well, I don't think players are going to enjoy having their themed bonuses constantly wrecked and chances of cultural victory ruined because the AI has money to throw around.
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Jul 10, 2013 04:59
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The White Dragon posted:Thanks, anyone interested can find the initial autosave at http://www.2shared.com/file/KCWusRZZ/AutoSave_Initial_0000_BC-4000.html What DLC does it use? I don't have any DLC beyond the Mongolia and Inca/Spain packs. 
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Jul 10, 2013 08:41
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Joeslop posted:
Back up that save and send it to 2K for dissection. There's no way that isn't a bug.  thehumandignity posted:Well, uh, like I said, Arabia decided to set up a trade route to a tiny city with no improved resources and no buildings instead of my capital. The range on caravans can be limiting depending on the map you're playing, so maybe the tiny city was the only one he could get to.
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Jul 11, 2013 08:19
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Brannock posted:Essentially. The big flaw with G&K was that there was dick-all to do lategame other than work towards a science victory. Diplomatic and Culture victories were tepid - BNW completely revamps them and made them actually exciting and engaging. I feel like the basic strategy to Diplomatic victory is still the same: get a lot of cash flow and buy out city-states. Mid-game when city-states aren't worth a lot of delegates there's some degree of finesse, but by the time the World Leader vote comes up you're practically guaranteed the win. Cultural victories are better, but still feels somewhat passive given that you're waiting on GA/GW/GMs to pop and tourism to stack up for most of it. There's most certainly a lot more complexity added, but I'm not so sure there's a lot more depth. After a premature end to my Venice game (crashed), I've decided that trade routes, while a good idea in theory, are poorly executed. This is primarily the fault of the UI, where every potential route is in a giant list without good sorting options (along with the majority of Civ5's UIs, this is a persistent problem). Finding current routes is more involved than it should be, seeing route paths is a pain, and it only gets worse over time as the number of routes available increases and your reach grows. Scrolling the route list to look for variations in the numbers gets tiresome quickly. Maybe I should just play on smaller maps so the UI isn't as frustrating.
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Jul 12, 2013 03:51
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uPen posted:I just sort the list by highest gold or highest gross and move on. Yeah, but I also check the city-states, because sometimes those routes have nearly as much profit and I can deny a civ some cash/science at the same time.
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Jul 12, 2013 04:01
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Rather Dashing posted:While Venice is the doge's bollocks (sorry) and probably my favourite Civ addition to play as, I think I learned in my last game not to rush for Optics and the policy branch that gives you the free Venician Merchant. Managed to completely cripple my finances within a very short time. You don't have to buy out a city-state with your Venetian Merchant. You can still use him as a regular GM and conduct a trade mission - this should give enough cash to bankroll a couple new trade routes, or rush-buy infrastructure. And with the extra influence you get from the mission, you can get an allied city-state early and hopefully be able to maintain it for long-term advantage.
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Jul 12, 2013 08:44
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Platystemon posted:God, I hate it when AI capitals are one tile away from the isthmus. It’s the bane of low sea level maps. That and it seems like nearly every map script tends to result in 2 tile width land bridges. Actually finding a spot where you can plant a canal city is harder than finding a Natural Wonder to settle next to in the early game.
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Jul 12, 2013 09:49
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:Tourism overall is probably overpowered. There just aren't enough practical counters. Culture victories are now really easy, and it's really drat difficult to outpace cultural influence. Seems like taking out anyone pushing tourism is the only real counter to tourism. It would be nice if there were more ways to control who can trade with you, for a starter. I want to be able to pull a North Korea. I think Tourism is deliberately designed this way - you're burning a lot of mid-game options for late-game effect. You need National Wonders to get the ball rolling, you want specific World Wonders for more slots, and a Great Work is a missed Golden Age or culture bomb. It's tough to get any significant multipliers going until well into the late-game, at which point everyone should already be racing for their win condition. If you want to pull a North Korea, declare war on everyone and pillage any trade route attempts. 
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Jul 12, 2013 10:12
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Platystemon posted:I do this, too. The other industrial era openers have their uses, but Industrialization made a huge leap in the rankings. I like using Industrialization as my opening Industrial Era tech because in addition to all of its obvious benefits, it has the easiest pre-reqs. My usual strategy is tech Economics and use Oxford University to pop Industrialization for free while I'm backfilling. Fertilizer is the other Industrial opening tech with only one pre-req, but it doesn't have quite the same dividends.
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Jul 12, 2013 23:55
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Even though the Foreign Legion is no longer the French UU, it's still in the UU list for Militaristic City-States. They also have a lower base combat strength, so with their +20% foreign lands bonus they're only up 0.4 combat strength over the Great War Infantry they replace. Overall, I'm not too impressed by them. You're only a couple techs from getting real Infantry at Plastics, and you can make units with the +15% from Heroic Epic so you're nearly at the same combat strength except with XP from your Barracks/etc and you keep that strength inside your borders. Right now the ideology to get 8 of them for free seems like a panic button more than anything else.
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Jul 13, 2013 02:45
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Well, that was new. Austria showed up and asked me to denounce England, then denounced me instead when I said no. All in the same diplomacy dialogue; I didn't even know that was going to happen.
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Jul 13, 2013 06:44
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Looks like Carriers got changed in BNW to have its own set of upgrade lines instead of the standard naval melee lines: Flight Deck for more cargo space, and Armor Plating for defensive strength. Base cargo space was reduced to 2 and base combat strength reduced to 40.
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Jul 13, 2013 07:20
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Alkydere posted:Nope. My only scout (on small continents there's really not a reason to make more than 1) died long before I got the ability to cross oceans. I had a ruins that detailed some sort of city razing between two city-states near the site. This was a Small Continents map as well, so both city-states and the ruins were on their own continent, they couldn't see each other, and the artifact was dated for the Classical era. The more I thought about it the more it was.
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Jul 14, 2013 07:58
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Zilkin posted:Diplomacy win should have been completely overhauled like culture was. Instead they kinda made it even worse by making money even easier, world leader votes now start automatically once civ(s) get advanced enough, and with how they changed the Globalization tech. Yeah, with the new diplomatic framework in place, getting votes from city-states is a holdover that isn't really necessary, especially when nearly everything you vote on has no effect on city-states (except Embargoing them, which you can ram down their throats with their own votes). Some cool changes might be reducing city-states to zero votes base with small numbers added for appropriate religion/policy choices, inability to send delegates on your own proposals (no relying on your own delegate muscle, probably need three proposals at a time so you have a choice to make), and a minimum Yea threshold instead of simply getting more Yeas. Would put a lot more pressure on actually interacting with other civs and keeping them happy.
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Jul 14, 2013 08:11
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Kly posted:I noticed that too, the game was running silky smooth (fast turns, high FPS, quiet GPU fan) with that patch then when BNW hit it all went back to normal. You have to recalculate the value of all trade routes every turn in BNW, so it's not a surprise turn timers get longer. Civ4 had a similar problem.
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Jul 14, 2013 19:23
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Inspector_71 posted:How do you pick your routes? If it's by gold, sort by that. If it's only to city-states, close the other sections. City-states sometimes give nearly as much gold as a regular city route but with no science bleed, so I always try to check them in addition to the regular civs - that's a lot of extra clicks, especially when the UI doesn't reset to the top of the list every time it's opened. And that's before factoring in the complexity of taking suboptimal routes for non-GPT bonuses, so sometimes you might be running a route to Rome to make yourself look less appetizing as a target, another route France to get that +25% tourism modifier, and a route to a city-state to fulfill their quest and get Allied status for resources. Those are all routes that are significant in the strategic picture, but the UI makes no effort to give you that information unless you start digging through other menus. The half-assed sorting options only make things worse by cluttering the view when trying to figure out which loving route just finished. Yeah, sometimes I just need cash and sorting by GPT is quick and easy. When you've already got a stable cash flow and want to leverage that advantage instead, the sorting quickly becomes a hindrance.
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Jul 15, 2013 03:52
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Sea routes are where the real cash is, land routes have more limited range and lack the 2x multiplier. Of course, it can be trickier to clear the barbarians out of the sea lanes.
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Jul 15, 2013 04:04
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ibntumart posted:What about if you leave the founding civilization alone---including their holy city---but manage to convert the majority to your religion? I sent a Shoshone Great Prophet and managed to convert Stockholm from Protestantism to the righteous worship of Duma Appah, which surprised me as I didn't know holy cities could be converted, let alone entirely lose their founder religion. Holy Cities will continuously generate pressure of their religion, but you can't see it until there's at least 1 follower. This isn't generally an issue unless you have no significant pressure of your own (i.e. Itinerant Preachers), however a founding civ will always pop Great Prophets of their religion, even if they're rush-buying with faith in a city that was converted to another religion. With a GP, they can quickly get majority again. As far as I can tell, the AI gives up the religion race when they hit the Industrial Era, probably because they burn their faith bank on other Great People. Haven't played enough games to confirm this though.
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Jul 16, 2013 05:56
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Cowcatcher posted:So what do I do if I want moar great people in early to mid game? Should I build more cities+gardens? Early game, the only things you can do is get the Liberty finisher and get Wonders that give you a free person. If you have Wonders with GPP though they'll start trickling in during the mid-game, and if you force specialists during the early-game you'll definitely see more people as a result. The problem is that actually doing any of that can stunt your growth unless you know what you're doing, as specialists can't provide their own food and all the buildings/wonders need significant investment to get early. In general, I tend to run low or no specialists until midway through the Renaissance, when I get the +2 science from specialists policy from the Rationalism tree. That's roughly the point where my cities are developed enough that feeding specialists is affordable, and getting extra science on top of their normal output is basically doubling their value. Saltin posted:I've been playing Civ since the very first iteration and know the game pretty well. I can win all sorts of ways, but one thing I cannot seem to get my head around in V is a modern war, mostly because I've never had to fight one. In my first play-through of BNW, it looks like I may have to fight one with France to get an outcome. Civ5 war strategy is get a big backbone of ranged attackers, with a handful of melee units to screen and actually capture cities. Modern Era means you have access to Artillery (base 3 range and Indirect Fire, it's very solid) and Bombers (awesome range, rush Air Repair as soon as possible and you can basically use them endlessly). Use your melee units to spot and absorb damage, shred anything that walks up with overlapping fields of fire, eventually bombard cities to zero and then walk in with your melee.
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Jul 16, 2013 20:53
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SlightlyMadman posted:Might be interesting to have a unique Citadel replacement that claims two tiles out instead of just one. Citadel replacement that doesn't have to be in/adjacent to your borders. 
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Jul 17, 2013 19:42
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Platystemon posted:Sweden is easily the second‐worst civ. Their are people who will defend gifting great people, but all things considered, it’s pretty weak. Yeah, you can gift admirals and generals, yeah, you can gift capture or almost spent great prophets, but how many of those will you really have to give, especially early in the game when it’s most important? With the changes to the culture side of the game, Sweden is actually a reasonably attractive choice for a tourism/culture game. You're now limited to the National Wonders for Artist/Writer/Musician specialists, so having an extra way to stack multipliers on it is good. You also get more benefit on bigger map sizes as you can get +100% or more GPP generation going with some careful diplomacy (made easier by the slightly more laid-back AI thanks to trading), and nab some more of that bigger city-state pool without relying entirely on cash. You can sit in your little corner of the world, generate mad amounts of tourism that has no distance penalties, and coast your way to victory. Thing is, very few people seem to play on bigger maps because the game runs more slowly and drags on more, and is arguably more difficult since there's more competition for wonders. Lots of dead space where nobody expands (more prevalent post-BNW happiness and culture changes), so barbarians are an annoyance throughout the game. And any UI that lists cities quickly becomes godawful when there's literally a hundred on of them on the map.
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Jul 18, 2013 08:31
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There's also the World Congress proposal that adds culture to Great Person Improvements, which is available relatively early in the game and can add up to a significant chunk of culture as a result. Most civs are happy when you propose it as well.
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Jul 18, 2013 22:41
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Started a new game, went exploring with a Scout, got him locked away behind Ottoman borders so he's done exploring. Noticed a Shoshone Settler about to head outside to plant a city, watched for about ten turns as it mills back and forth before it finally goes outside, I declare war and steal it. Peace is declared after the minimum wait is up, I get 1gpt and 3 Horses (more than I expected, really). I continue scouting their borders and realize that their pasture is pillaged, but I still have the Horses. I have no Horses in my starting location. e: This must be a game of bugs or something, because the Candi (Indonesian Garden replacement) is giving me faith when there are no religious followers at all in my city. Pantheon selection menu popped up and I went WTF, I shouldn't have any faith generation. isndl fucked around with this message at 01:06 on Jul 19, 2013 |
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Jul 19, 2013 00:51
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I have confirmed that as Indonesia, settling on top of another resource will wipe that resource if you get the bonus UA resource. I settled on a Silver and it has become Nutmeg.
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Jul 19, 2013 01:24
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The White Dragon posted:I'd actually advise him against it and to stick with where he is. All those non-Fish coastal tiles? They're completely worthless. Sea trade routes are miles ahead of land routes, however. If you can nab Colossus you're set for the rest of the game.
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Jul 19, 2013 04:08
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Marketing New Brain posted:Candi is base two faith, then two more faith for each religion. So if you just have the normal one religion, it will output four faith. This is presumably to make up for the fact that it is hard to build in all your cities. Ah, that would explain it. Guess I was too busy reading the awkward description to notice. Overall it still seems like a fairly lackluster building, I was just lucky that most of the civs in that game were too preoccupied doing other things to rush all the religions by the time I had it built. Early war declarations seem to really screw with civs that aren't building up for conquest. The Shoshone never recovered from my Settler steal, I just drifted around with my Scout and picked up another Worker, raided his trade routes a couple times, and he never built another combat unit besides his starting Pathfinder. Then eventually the Ottomans next door walked in with an army of Swordsmen and took him out in three turns flat.
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Jul 19, 2013 04:40
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Could have liberated Japan, gifted them a crappy iceball city you plant specifically for this purpose, then declared war and retaken the capital. Not sure if they'll still vote for you though. But really, the votes are swung by who has the most city-states not who has the best diplomacy, so it'd work out about the same either way.
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Jul 20, 2013 07:45
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