|
To get into technicalities, Umineko (and Higurashi for that matter) is not actually a Visual Novel - it's a related type of work called a Kinetic Novel. Visual Novels have choices that let you as a player influence what is happening to some extent or another, whereas Kinetic Novels are literally a book in visual form, and thus there are no choices (well okay, there's exactly one choice in Umineko, at the very end of the last episode). Umineko specifically is a mystery novel, where the challenge is figuring out what's going on, or just how something happened, before the characters do.
|
#
¿
Sep 20, 2016 23:55
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ Apr 28, 2024 07:33 |
|
|
EagerSleeper posted:I think I'd be quite fine with everyone dying in this story so far, with exception to Natsuhi. The Ushiromiya family is bonkers. Hey now, the kids haven't proven themselves utter assholes deserving of death. Yet. 
|
|
#
¿
Sep 23, 2016 00:13
|
|
|
Maria is 9, Ange is 6. As for the other stuff, the cousins generally only see each other at these yearly meetings as far as I recall (and far longer for Battler, of course), so while they certainly KNOW Maria, it's not like they're incredibly familiar with her. And prior to this scene Rosa was acting much more low-key and reserved in the scene where Krauss, Eva, and Rudolf were all tossing around veiled threats and mockery regarding the money, so it's really this scene that's her first establishing moment. And what a moment it is.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 23, 2016 21:47
|
|
|
KataraniSword posted:
Knox's Commandments regarding detective/mystery works are generally in effect for Umineko, so that shouldn't be a problem. I think there are a few violations or flat out ignored ones over the entirety of the work, but it's mostly solvable if you very carefully piece it together. It's just really bloody hard. On a side note, will you see about getting the [color][/color] tag enabled for the thread, ProfessorProf, either now or starting during episode 2? Or just ignore it as that may tempt previous players to get a bit too revealing?
|
|
#
¿
Oct 3, 2016 20:11
|
|
|
ProfessorProf posted:I didn't realize this was a thing I could do. Do I just annoy a mod about it? I honestly have no clue. I was just running off of this line in the BBCode description. "Again, these tags are only available when buying a custom title or where otherwise specifally stated." Presumably that means there are some other situations aside from custom titles where it's allowed, but I could be wrong in it ever being allowed for a normal thread.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 3, 2016 20:30
|
|
|
Of course, if you DO go with the idea that this theoretical 19th person exists, is there a reason the count cannot go even higher? Perhaps a 20th person, or a 21st? Why stop there, perhaps there are really 30 people on the island? Prove me wrong.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 4, 2016 21:27
|
|
|
Qrr posted:So this one seems to be more interesting if there were 18 people. It seems like everyone was travelling in pairs or hanging out as a group. Unlike the previous late night murder, alibis should be pretty solid for this one (unless Nanjo is complicit, of course, and mucks up time of death). That would make Kinzo an obvious suspect, of course. I think my favorite has always been World End Dominator, among other reasons due to the scenes it's used for, but we won't be hearing that for the first time until late Episode 2 if I recall correctly. Golden Slaughterer is definitely one of the best though. The murder weapon sure does cast suspicion on Kinzo, or at least someone who's been in his room, though. Because where else in the house would you find occultish spikes like those? Unless it really is the witch.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 7, 2016 00:29
|
|
|
Qrr posted:It sounds like later episodes will fix this, but as stands that is indeed an unsatisfying ending. That she apparently wrote while being murdered! And yeah, this is supposed to be a confusing and unsatisfying end for the first episode, because at this point no one has even started to figure out what the hell is going on.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 12, 2016 19:54
|
|
|
Huh, I had apparently forgotten that we got the TIPS for the stakes at the end of Episode 1. Thought that wasn't until sometime next episode for... reasons.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 12, 2016 21:23
|
|
|
Eh, whatever.
Lord Koth fucked around with this message at 03:33 on Oct 13, 2016 |
|
#
¿
Oct 13, 2016 03:06
|
|
|
Qrr posted:I mean, Kinzo was drinking Chekov's glowing green booze earlier in this story. I assume something will happen with that eventually because it was mentioned quite a lot until Kinzo vanished. ...I don't think it's a spoiler to say that what Kinzo is drinking is Absinthe, a liquor associated with quite a few eccentrics and has more than a few times in history been banned in various countries due to concerns regarding its effects (which have probably been exaggerated). Wormwood is one of the ingredients in making it. It may or may not be normal absinthe, or he may (or may not) be adding something mysterious to it, but the type of liquor is known and just being described in a colorful manner. If someone actually thinks knowing the type of liquor is some sort of spoiler, I'll remove this. resurgam40 posted:And is this a paycheck I see before me...? Oh, what the heck, I'll take the plunge; good work should be supported. Neither Higurashi or Umineko were considered particularly great adaptations compared to their source, but it still turned out well enough in the case of Higurashi (especially Kai) that it was still decent - if still nowhere near as good as the novel. Umineko? Not so much. Lord Koth fucked around with this message at 00:29 on Oct 15, 2016 |
|
#
¿
Oct 15, 2016 00:25
|
|
|
But why wouldn't you refer to furniture as furniture? You're confusing me here with strange talk seeming to imply they're not furniture.  That's just silly.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 17, 2016 03:28
|
|
|
oath2order posted:In episode 6 we learn that Kanon has never bought clothing for himself before, and so accidentally walked into an anime cosplay shop, unable to tell the difference. Speaking of anime cosplay, that wasn't Jessica's outfit in the original game. In that, she was dressed as, well...  In addition there was an insert song during that sequence, also related to Touhou. Presumably they were both changed/removed in the later releases for copyright reasons. Oh, there's also some singing of a song involving Oyashiro-sama and their antics, but not talking about that any more. ProfessorProf's LP has got me replaying Higurashi due to the recent release on Steam of the last of its Question arcs, and I'm currently debating doing an LP of it. Still working out the mechanics and the time requirements, but at least considering it.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 20, 2016 16:28
|
|
|
edit: Was misremembering something, so removed so as to not cause confusion.
Lord Koth fucked around with this message at 22:56 on Oct 26, 2016 |
|
#
¿
Oct 26, 2016 22:48
|
|
|
resurgam40 posted:Creepy Maria does have a point here which exposes the entire flaw in the "flip the chessboard" logic- Battler's assuming it will reveal the opponent through their moves, but what if the opponent isn't playing chess, but checkers? Or Go or Shogi or what have you? The chess analogy only works if you consider things through the rules of chess, and Battler is clearly no chess player with the amount of times he's been caught in circular arguments. "Making different moves" is certainly something to expect, but Maria calls it magic when it's really cheating. When it's making up your own drat moves and saying you've won because no one realizes... which is pretty much what Beatrice has done all this game, hasn't she? Well, yes and no. If his opponent actually is a witch and using magic, you're correct. But Battler is arguing that the murders are not being committed using magic, and thus his opponent is NOT, in fact, a witch. Ergo, she's still playing chess as opposed to something else, but she's trying her best to convince him otherwise. Arguments regarding Battler seeming to be terrible at chessboard thinking do seem to be true, so far, regardless though, so that's right on the money.
|
|
#
¿
Oct 30, 2016 22:31
|
|
|
grandalt posted:Battler, Battler, Battler. If there is no witch, than the people you thought you knew you don't. You have to be willing to say that either a family member or a servant is the killer or else you have lost before you have begun. To be fair, Beato said that right to his face this update anyways. The initial goal of their little game was simple: Prove witches don't exist by showing that the crimes can be done via a means other than magic. Battler is actively making the game harder on himself by adding other conditions - chief among which is that he consciously refuses to use a theory involving one of the servants or relatives being the culprit. Hell, if it wasn't for Beato "kindly" including a human Beatrice for Battler to try and blame, she could have had someone turn up murdered in the middle of the garden with a pair of gardening shears, no closed room remotely nearby, and Battler still wouldn't be able to prove it wasn't done with magic, given the extra conditions he's adding on.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 10, 2016 00:44
|
|
|
To be fair, Beato mentions that since he was showing fear at getting eaten, he wasn't completely broken yet - and thus could potentially still return to his stubborn denials and have another match.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 23, 2016 23:11
|
|
|
The Stakes do have a character song that has something of a Christmas theme that should be safe to post by then - on the assumption it's done with Polsy or the like due to associated videos. That's actually their second character song too. Their first one is already safe to post, and it's... interesting. Amidiri posted:I don't understand how denying the witch works. Surely if you accept her once, you can't just dial it back and be like 'actually, since you're mean, just kidding, I don't believe you exist', right? Surely?? If they later change their mind, they've clearly not accepted the truth of her existence completely. Thus, they still need to be "educated" more. 
Lord Koth fucked around with this message at 17:53 on Nov 24, 2016 |
|
#
¿
Nov 24, 2016 17:51
|
|
|
bman in 2288 posted:Should I blame Kinzo for this entire scenario, then? I'm gonna do that anyways. Don't feel much sympathy towards the man, anyways. No matter how amusing Kinzo can come across occasionally due to his long-winded BEATRICE!!! rants, the answer is yes, you can blame literally everything on Kinzo. Other individuals may or may not share blame as well for certain things, but ultimately everything is mostly his fault. He did a drat fine job loving up his entire family.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 25, 2016 04:52
|
|
|
Minor thing, but Human Side Beatrice should have one more slide for when you try and execute her again after already being on that second screen. Just an amusing little extra.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 25, 2016 19:38
|
|
|
Honestly, the non-red parts of what the Stakes wear is just a callback to the outfit of the waitresses of a certain restaurant in HIgurashi that was relatively popular among guys for some reason. Regardless of whether there's a deeper meaning behind any of the various callbacks in Umineko or not, Ryukishi07 simply likes putting them in his works.alcharagia posted:let's all just take a moment to appreciate this fantastic name for Lady Lambdadelta SUPER PAPER is better . Though I'll give you the new one is great too.Some further thoughts: -I mostly sympathize with Gohda. He's basically a high class chef who was used to having an extensive support staff to serve most dishes, with him only stepping in with whatever the masterpiece of the night was. Also, he's got to feel some resentment over being outranked in the servant hierarchy (so far as Kinzo is concerned) by teenagers, and that combined with the previous point means he's probably going to take it out on them to at least a minor extent due to wounded pride. Finally, I'm pretty sure most of the scenes where we've seen him being his worst were from Kanon's point of view, and Kanon has not exactly proven to have the nicest thoughts about many of those around him either. -Don't bother trying to explain what's happening in the meta-world in terms of no magic. The witches are already teleporting around in front of meta-Battler, and plenty of other magical crap is going to be happening there as well. If Bern and Lamda actually appear on the island still blatantly performing magic that's one thing, but that hasn't happened yet. As much as meta-Battler is denying witches exist he never bothers to try and explain what's going around him in the meta-world, and the witches aren't trying to make him. Stick to proving magic wasn't necessary to commit the crimes on the island, and you'll go far less crazy.
|
|
#
¿
Nov 27, 2016 07:01
|
|
|
KataraniSword posted:I think the distinction is that the Sisters/Stakes are explicitly meant to be the embodiment of the sin, and thus take on the names of the demons most associated with that sin? So that Asmodeus is more the "Lust" part than the "demon" part, and assumedly all the others would be the same. Even this doesn't really hold true, if you look at the profiles we already have for them. Some of them seemingly embody their sin fairly well (Leviathan, Beelzebub), some of them induce it in others (Belphegor) and others are just sorta kinda embodying it (Lucifer, who is indeed incredibly prideful, but at the same time feels pleasure in submission - not something you would really expect from the embodiment of Pride).
|
|
#
¿
Dec 2, 2016 15:38
|
|
|
Really, why would a being such as Beatrice command belief? Far better to slowly, and painfully, drag someone into acceptance of your existence of their own free will. Far more entertaining that way, as mind control is simply boring.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 14, 2016 17:13
|
|
|
To be fair, the part Battler really seemed to go off about was the whole "And then Beatrice destroys the entire landscape in battle with her former teacher, then fixes it once said battle is done," rather than the Furniture-related things. So while the non-reaction in episode 2 is still dubious, you can sort of reason your way around it by just seeing Battler as ignoring it. It's nowhere near a great reasoning, but it still kind of fits. And the Virgilia reference in the second character song for the Sisters was the minor spoiler I noticed - I think it was the only one.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 15, 2016 19:31
|
|
|
KataraniSword posted:He's the only one, as far as I can recall, who didn't have other people around to testify for said alibi. The adults were all fighting about inheritance, the kids were all shored up in the guest house Playing D&D, of course! Or perhaps some cheap knockoff version.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 17, 2016 02:49
|
|
|
Jeek posted:Thinking back to earlier in the episode, it is heavily implied that there were two human Beatrices, with one of them being Kinzo's original mistress and the other being her rape kid We've seen absolutely nothing to support this so no, it's not actually safe to assume that. You can hypothesize that if you want, but currently there is literally zero evidence to back this up.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 23, 2016 17:09
|
|
. So maybe we can assume that the gold-storage room is where Kinzo locked up the first Beatrice, and the mansion being where the second one was raised after her mother's suicide?
|
To be fair, Leviathan is apparently powered by something that Kyrie simply possessed in far, FAR greater amounts, and Rudolf won simply by shooting at someone other than Belphegor. Kyrie's win was fully legitimate, but Rudolf's was purely because Eva Beatrice is an arrogant bitch and stayed in a dangerous area.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 28, 2016 18:15
|
|
|
Eh, Higurashi Kira isn't great, but it's still not the worst thing to come out of Studio DEEN in regards to that property. No, I'm pretty sure that title belongs to Higurashi no Naku Koro ni Kaku: Outbreak.
|
|
#
¿
Dec 31, 2016 07:55
|
|
|
Fabulousvillain posted:May as well get my dumb theory out of the way before Beato answers for us. I noticed that when Battler asked about Multiple personalities she denied Jessica doing it and not Eva's body. So I'm gonna say it was the Eva Beatrice personality that killed Nanjo using Eva's body. She did so under the supervision of Battler, but just under his nose so that Nanjo could see this happening and Battler could not. Obviously Jessica could not see this happening, but it would have to be quiet enough that at least Battler could not hear it since it would have happened just before a door was shut while Jessica may or may not have discovered what happened. Eva refutes this literally in the same paragraph she says Jessica's body had nothing to do with the murder.  This also applies to Battler and Eva. This is even aside from the red regarding Battler watching Eva and giving her no chance.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 7, 2017 02:43
|
|
|
oath2order posted:Jeez, does know one here know how to Red Text? I guess you are incompetent. ...Probably because I wasn't red texting, but rather was emphasizing that line to highlight the Battler and Eva part. If I'd been red texting, I would have used the entire segment. Certainly someone just failed to Red Text correctly.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 7, 2017 03:21
|
|
|
oath2order posted:Clearly if you just look at the file name for her image it will reveal... To be fair, quite a few of the thumbnails are fairly worthless for figuring out someone's name. Go look at Virgillia's or the Stakes or, hell, even Battler's. Though Ms. New Character's is amusing. And maybe I need to actually get on Discord at some point, because watching the thread completely miss the North Wind and Sun reference and buying into everything after was indeed hilarious. That would require looking into Discord though.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 8, 2017 18:41
|
|
|
Fabulousvillain posted:Didn't it just imply that Eva bribed the police off? I do think it's weird to think they expect anyone to believe that the other 17 killed each other and/or themselves, but to be fair the public thinks that's complete bullshit which is part of why she turned out the way she did. No, it implied that that's what the media claimed, with absolutely no evidence to back up their claims, to play to the court of public opinion. Nothing in the update implies anything about Eva covering, or not, up her theoretical crime, or how. "Well, she just inherited a fortune under mysterious circumstances, and the police couldn't figure it out. CLEARLY she bribed them." Ange seemingly just jumped off a building, yes, but I'm pretty sure she didn't go through a window afterwards. Glass shattering sounds are just a relatively common sound in VNs/games to represent breaking through dimensions (in this case time). She didn't literally come through a window in the previous update, as she simply appeared right in the middle of the hall.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 10, 2017 19:47
|
|
|
oath2order posted:Of course, just because that's what the media believes doesn't mean it's wrong. 10 tons of gold buys a lot of bribes, if push comes to shove. Sure, she might perfectly well have bribed them. But that's purely speculation from the information we currently have available - there was nothing in the actual update implying that definitely happened.
|
|
#
¿
Jan 10, 2017 20:08
|
|
|
Tender Child Loins posted:I had a hunch that the Beatrice and Virgilia in that scene were Shannon and Kumasawa, respectively. Maria just elaborated on the details, in the same way as she did with her pajama party. Handwriting matches what? Ange doesn't have definitive handwriting samples for Shannon or Kumasawa, just Maria's actual diary. She can certainly prove or disprove whether the pages in the bottles are written by Maria, but she has no way to do the same for Shannon or Kumasawa. If the handwriting does not match Maria's, we have no real way of figuring out who wrote those messages at the moment, other than that they likely actually did know Maria due to the contents.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 1, 2017 20:39
|
|
|
I'm going to take a wild guess that Gaap isn't in the fighting game simply because her specific powers would be a headache to translate into a sane moveset, especially since it was actually made by 07th Expansion and initially released at Comiket rather than some major game studio. Most of the other characters have relatively straightforward attacks, rather than "make holes anywhere I feel like that lead to anywhere I like." Alternatively she just wasn't particularly popular, and relatively minor, so they didn't bother. It could of course be something else - hell, the reason might even be mentioned somewhere - but I've never really gone looking for the reasons behind that omission.
|
|
#
¿
Feb 27, 2017 04:15
|
|
|
BurningStone posted:The obvious twist is to swap the fates of the babies: the legitimate child, Battler, died and our Battler is the illegitimate one. Just exchange the newborns' identities. That's why Beatrice attacks him through his mother, even though his tie into the family, and this whole mess, is through his father. Too bad Battler isn't bright enough to explore this. He's also not bright enough to realize that if he can attempt to speak red, even about things he doesn't know, he should be able to wrap everything up in ten minutes. Not that Battler is incompetent isn't still true, but he's generally seemed fairly bright - just completely out of his depth. To explore the possibility people have been talking about, I can think of very few people who wouldn't suddenly panic and mentally shut down if they suddenly could not use true speak (red text here, but the concept exists elsewhere) to say the name of the person they thought was their mother for the last 18 years, regardless of if there are ways to reason yourself around it. So saying he's not bright enough to explore the other possibilities of gaining access to red text at this particular moment is extremely unfair. Also, taking the "Asumu/Kyrie's children were swapped at birth" theory into account, why would it matter whose child Battler was in regards to changing his legitimacy status? Rudolf wasn't married to either of them at the time, so it's not a matter of being born out of wedlock or not - both children (the live and stillbirth) were born outside it. And Beatrice never stated in red that he wasn't legitimate, she just claimed that after he started panicking.
|
|
#
¿
Mar 5, 2017 07:05
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ Apr 28, 2024 07:33 |
|
|
Battler most certainly does NOT have to say how he might be Kinzo's grandchild. Ange already stated in blue how he could be such, while still following the red from before, and Beatrice did not refute it in red. Remember, blue truth has to be countered with red, or it is taken to be the truth. Ergo, Battler is Kinzo's grandchild because he's Rudolf's son. And yes, Beatrice technically has till the end of the game to do so, but there's basically no reason for her to wait in this particular instance if she was capable of refuting it. There's also the whole Ange calling him older brother in red, and the reverse from Battler, though I suppose you could claim he was adopted or something to get around that particular statement (not taking other statements into account). Lord Koth fucked around with this message at 09:58 on Mar 10, 2017 |
|
#
¿
Mar 10, 2017 09:56
|
|