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Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
So I got CULTIC a while back and as much as I want to like it, I find the combat rather confusing in terms of how the game intends you to approach it, like it's going for equal parts survival horror and action movie combat, which feels incredibly awkward to me. I wonder what's the best way to mess with stuff like the custom difficulty settings to make it more straight-forward.

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Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
Thinking about it, I can better see why Cultic's "normal" is clearly easy but renamed now.

They really want you to practice and get into the vibe of the game before taking on its proper challenge.

And here my hubris led me to think it would be enough like Blood to play fast and loose when Cultic isn't nearly as forgiving with resources like ammo.

Didn't have that much problem with health on hard but ammo is so fricking tight.

So I wound up taking every encounter as strategically as possible just to preserve ammo, despite the trailer making it clear that you're supposed to be able to jump around like a madman Caleb-style, and after a few levels it started to feel really tedious and I lost interest.

I guess this is a case like Ultrakill where they expect you be good at being both fast and precise at the same time to get the most out of the game, which I'm really not.

I can generally only do one or the other at a time.

Joe Chill posted:

Playing through Doom 64 for the first time and I just wanted to say: The yellow key puzzle in Final Outpost (map08) is bulllllllshit. That is something I would never figure out on my own in a million years.

"Buy the strategy guide today!" :retrogames:

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
So I'm unclear on whether Cultic has any sort of adaptive mechanics that change how things progress based on how you play it (e.g. different ammo drops for using different weapons) or if it's just static/set and I'm misunderstanding the advice.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Baron von Eevl posted:

I don't think there's anything adaptive, ammo/health drops are as far as I can tell random. What was the advice that's confusing you?

edit if it was the thing about the shotgun, it just deals insane damage once you upgrade it and ammo is plentiful.

So the impression I get overall is: get better at making headshots on the move and focus on one weapon at a time when upgrading (starting with the shotgun). Seems to be working well so far, so thanks.

I guess I underestimated the shotgun's usefulness due to it starting at "modern shotgun lol" levels of accuracy before upgrades, but now I realize even then it's a solid way of doing away with baddies if you play it smart.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
Easily one of my favorite YT clips

https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxXWssIn5PhGCuJK24nKEyHGqw4cTOLj5q

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
As far as I'm concerned Halo is the only worthwhile console-centric FPS series, not counting Metroid Prime because that's first-person metroidvania more than shooter.

And frankly even then it still plays better with KB+M, with the PC port of Halo CE being the game that made me realize that I wasn't actually terrible at FPS games, since hoo boy did the experience of trying out a good few of them back then with analog sticks make me think otherwise.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
So the thing about SIGIL 2 is it started out being the name of the Doom 2 wad that Romero evidently had planned for Doom 2's 30th anniversary when One Humanity was released for charity.

But then that got quietly walked back at some point and SIGIL 2 became the title of the Doom 1 wad for that game's 30th.

Wouldn't be surprised if the Doom 2 wad ends up being called SIGIL 3 but who knows at this point.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Cream-of-Plenty posted:

I'm loving the celebrity endorsements




Ego Software would've made a solid alternative name for Ion Storm. Or at least a more honest one.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
I was just thinking today about how this one mod, Thrifty Ammo, doesn't work with another, Final Doomer, and if I might be able to figure out a way to make a patch by studying the DRLA patch for the former even tho I'm not a programmer at all. Of course, the former mod is in zscript while the latter is in decorate/acs, so it feels kinda doubly out of my depth.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
Unfortunately I think they officially capped it at nine weapon sets, so adding anymore sets based on other wads would have to be in the form of fan add-ons or copycat mods.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

death cob for cutie posted:

Godspeed - I am a programmer and DRLA is one of the things I've been looking at.

Then again, not being a programmer may make you more resilient to bullshit; when I look at this stuff, all I can think is "but why did you choose to do ZScript this way?"

I think the thing I have to do is swap out the item classes that Thrifty Ammo is looking for with the classes that Final Doomer replaces the default ones with but I have no idea how I should do that in practice. Given that there's nine different sets of item pickups associated with each weapon set, doing just one to see if it's even possible seems like the sanest place to start.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

drrockso20 posted:

This definitely ties into the praise Civvie gives to the good Build Engine games and how they handle level design, the balance they often achieved between "this feels like a real place" and "this is a fun level"

"Cartoon pseudo-realism" is such a good way of summarizing it, where it looks like it could be a place that exists, but the mapper never puts realism above the gameplay.

Personally tho, I've always thought of it as "naturalistic" level design due to the emphasis being more on having the level flow organically from one part to the next, since having the flow come to a halt, whether due to too much realism or simple bad level design, is more likely to break immersion and draw attention to the game's artifice than anything else.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Hasturtium posted:

This made me laugh out loud. I absolutely knew they were nazis but I’d only heard about Wolfenstein and never tried it, so I was wandering around going, “what the gently caress IS this” over and over again. The cyberdemon in MAP32 was probably the first time I screamed in fear playing an FPS, so that was nice.

"GUTEN TAG!" :unsmigghh:

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Cream-of-Plenty posted:

No you're remembering correctly, it was the Doom Guy model from Quake 3 https://tonyhawkgames.fandom.com/wiki/Doom_Guy

Should've implemented his cut voice lines from Quake 3 on PS2.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P9oKCHOaREo

"The ground makes an unfriendly pillow" indeed

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Al Cu Ad Solte posted:

Cool as poo poo looking Indiana Jones/The Mummy inspired TC (total conversion) for Doom:

https://forum.zdoom.org/viewtopic.php?t=78218

Gameplay vid here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeMYa16rdVQ

I love how it says "The Mummy/Indiana Jones/Tomb Raider-inspired" on the release page.

Like yeah, you just needed to say Indiana Jones lol.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
Tried playing Invisible War out of sheer morbid curiosity a while back and I really haven't played any other game that's felt so deeply and obviously compromised to the point that it's more akin to a prototype or tech demo than a finished game.

Specifically it feels uncannily like a really derpy prototype to Mass Effect more than anything to do with Deus Ex, and that's really the most interesting thing about it as far as the final product goes.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
It would mean no comical legbreaking sounds in TF2... and that's about it.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

drrockso20 posted:

I feel like TF2 is a bit of an exception since falling damage helps balance out the hyper mobility that Scout, Soldier, and Demoman can all achieve, well that and seeing someone die and ragdoll in a comedic fashion from fall damage will always be hilarious

True and fair.

quote:

It really feels like what a Duke 3D sequel made in 98 to 2000 on a contemporary engine of the time would have played like

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUUXf1VhVNc

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
The funniest thing about The Last Exterminator is how pointedly anachronistic the Adlib FM synth soundtrack feels compared to the rest of the "look at all this cool poo poo we can do with our fancy new 3D engine" presentation.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

The 7th Guest posted:

this one's gonna be interesting since at least a third of the featured games aren't first person shooters this time, but i guess they fall into a genre/aesthetical venn diagram overlap

When I saw that 3D Realms was publishing a spiritual sequel to Command & Conquer, I was quite surprised indeed.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Tried playing this in Raze only to get the oh-so-helpful "error opening map file". Anyone have any idea why this keeps happening? The mod page says it should work with Raze and it's clear that the ini file is already recognized and all that but it just can't load the map for some unspecified reason.

e: Tried loading it as a custom map instead and it opened just file despite still throwing up an error message... Except when reloading a save. Then it crashes again.

Doctor Bishop fucked around with this message at 01:04 on Oct 1, 2023

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
Also the Steam page lists 16GB of RAM as the minimum/recommended amount.

This is like the ED-209 of video games.

"Who cares if it works or not!"

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Grimthwacker posted:

Wait, wait, hear me out. . .

Fire Warrior, but actually good this time!

In other words, a game where you're stomping around in a Tau battlesuit, so basically doubling as "what if Shogo was good" as well.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Convex posted:

You should try Marrow, it's great

It'd be nice if they would fix that to work with something other than Fresh Supply.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Hasturtium posted:

Does it not work with NBlood? I’ve been running Marrow on NBlood in Linux (on a decidedly uncommon CPU no less) and am more than halfway through so far.

Tried it with both NBlood and Raze and neither works.

I got the first map to load by treating it as a regular custom map, but then it crashed as soon as I tried reloading a save.

Seemingly I'm the only one that it doesn't work for at all, but I have seen one other instance of someone not being able to load one of the later maps which the mapper acknowledged as an issue, so I'm hopeful that there will be an update that maybe fixes this issue.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Hasturtium posted:

I hope so too. The only error I ran into in Linux was the case-sensitive file system not wanting to play ball with the MRW0x naming scheme; I manually renamed each map to mrw0x, and since then it’s been fine with ./nblood -ini marrow.ini. Knock on wood… we’ll see if I have any luck in later levels or if it crashes on me.

That got me thinking about file system poo poo and I finally got it working by... unzipping the folder and pointing Raze at the folder as the "-file" parameter.

Build ports confuse the hell out of me.

e: Oh yeah and also moving all the stuff into the same folder because the original setup was dumb for having the music files separate.

Doctor Bishop fucked around with this message at 18:52 on Oct 11, 2023

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Hasturtium posted:

It’s weird - Full Supply expects mods to be in their own subfolder, while NBlood just wants Marrow to be unzipped into the root folder with -ini pointing to the INI file. I hadn’t tried Raze yet - it compiled successfully for me but didn’t want to work with my Blood install for some reason. Normally I’d want to get to the bottom of it, but with NBlood working I may not bother…

I took the original zipped version and moved everything into the same folder inside it and that works fine as well, so yeah, it was all because of the music files not being where they were expected to be.

Goofy that it took me that long to realize but y'know what, it's a goofy problem to have and also I got some bad information to put the files into a folder inside the folder with the maps and such, which definitely didn't help.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
Following the development updates on Deathwish makes it seem like 2.0 is going to be less an update and more a sequel/redux at this point, so playing the current version is definitely worthwhile because of how utterly different the next is going to be.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
Funny thing about Blood is that since the source code was lost, every "port" is in fact a reconstruction, either reverse-engineering the game based on its differences from Duke 3D's source code (NBlood, Raze, BloodGDX) or remaking it in another engine entirely (Fresh Supply).

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

SCheeseman posted:

It wasn't lost, it was in the hands of Matt Saettler the whole time. He threw hints at reverse engineering devs on IRC now and again.

So he had the source code and never released it?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b7oscFP-IbM

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

site posted:

the doom/2 remaster is just gzdoom with voxel doom 2

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M_BHcSVTRw

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
Necrovision strikes me as a game that could really do with a remake to take the core concept of "a horde of monsters crawl out of the underworld to make the hell of WWI even worse and you gotta brawl your way thru them" and make it actually work, especially since it seems like they could do much better in today's post-Doom-2016 FPS landscape.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

The Kins posted:

Gloomwood also has a new update coming this week that adds togglable Seasonal Content in the form of everyone's favorite Halloween staple: Turnips.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oOzMSO8Oowg

I see they're returning jack-o-lanterns to their roots... literally!

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

What I'm curious about is what's the difference between parallax and normal mapping in this case.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Disproportionation posted:

Normal mapping determines which sections of a texture appear to be lit when hit by a directional light source - which gives the illusion of depth, whereas parallax involves different layers that move (or rather, are moved at different speeds when the player moves, also giving the illusion of depth. Think objects in the horizon in a 2d game moving slower than objects in the foreground, only on a smaller scale.

I don't think normal mapping is really possible or at least wouldn't be as effective in doom, mostly because light isn't really directional in it, though I'm sure someone will be able to correct me on that.

Alright that makes perfect sense.

I completely forgot that normal mapping only affects lighting, so for a game that distinctly predates lighting effects as we know them, parallax textures would make the most sense as a standalone mod.

Since doing normal mapping would require a completely reworked lighting system as well, which would be a lot of additional work that wouldn't be nearly as universally applicable anyways due to how different mappers handle Doom's native sector lighting.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
Goon face-blindness strikes again!

Jokes aside, looks like some pretty solid gameplay and a nice art style he's got going there, though with how fast-paced it appears to be (that timer is concerning), it'll probably be a bit too hectic for me in practice.

That's one thing that kinda bothers me about the retro FPS renaissance, how many games seem to have consistently headshotting enemies while moving at insane breakneck speeds as a base expectation for playing them properly rather than things you can do to style on the game after getting really good at it.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
So I've been playing Marathon 2 after being reminded of that series and man, the movement is so loving weird. And in certain levels, it's a lot weirder.

I get that it's supposed to be like, low gravity and all that, but it still feels like you're being thrust forwards uncontrollably and that fucks with every instinct I have for these kinds of games.

I mean you can control your direction really well but bringing yourself to a stop? That's another story.

Honestly, the more of this game I play, the more I think that MadSpace may have taken a good bit of inspiration from it.

Or maybe they were just both really plugged into the 90s zeitgeist when it came to imagining what aliens and their architecture would look like.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.
Y'all are missing the actual important part: the Dusk SDK finally being released in full.

Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

site posted:

stolen from the discord, there's a sin sourceport out

https://cohost.org/rohit/post/3207148-release-dominatrix

Just checked this out after a friend mentioned it and I can almost immediately see why it took so long for someone to be madlad enough to bother source porting SiN. How do you take a game like Quake 2 that has perfectly good movement and screw it up like that? Yet another layer to the enigma that is SiN.

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Doctor Bishop
Oct 22, 2013

To understand what happened at the diner, we use Mr. Papaya. This is upsetting because he is the friendliest of fruits.

Doctor Bishop posted:

Just checked this out after a friend mentioned it and I can almost immediately see why it took so long for someone to be madlad enough to bother source porting SiN. How do you take a game like Quake 2 that has perfectly good movement and screw it up like that? Yet another layer to the enigma that is SiN.

Having played a bit more of it, I can safely describe SiN as feeling "playable in spite of itself", since it seems like it tries to undo everything that worked about Quake 2's movement and shooting but doesn't do quite enough to actually ruin the core gameplay, just weaken it considerably.

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