Popehoist posted:

No cake song on the OST, no buy

Blaziken386 posted:

While on the subject of Rebellion, can I say that I particularly enjoyed this scene?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OP3hJJGwyBc
I went into Rebellion not knowing anything about it in regards to the plot. The beginning was cute, stylishly animated, and set up the basic premise of the world it was taking place in, then this scene popped up to remind everyone that "hey, this is PMMM you're watching, the world only looks cute."

Mordaedil posted:

When a lot of anime fans compare Rebellion to School Days, is when I think anime fans have a really long way to go in terms of undoing their own boxed environment.

This series is at its best when it asks the uncomfortable questions and a lot of people just can't seem to deal and it makes me somewhat jittery.

Namtab posted:

I'm pretty sure madoka would work even if it wasn't Japanese animation

Namtab posted:

Lol if you watch any anim 16 times

cheetah7071 posted:

Sometimes boobs are just boobs, not weapons used by the patriarchy to oppress women.

Endorph posted:

can we discuss how much the canaan op owns

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIQ-Rc5B21o

(it's alot)

Insurrectionist posted:

Ate all the food? I think we know who the REAL villain of Madoka is.

.jpg posted:

I think you've all been very mean to Lord Justice over the past few days. He just wants Madoka to get the same respect any pure and beautiful work of art deserves

In fact, I've been working closely with him to put together the definitive Rebellion masterwork edition, as it was intended to be from the start. I've rendered out a few sample cuts so you can get a feel for what our vision is really about

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IxukdpAD1Ew

Super Jay Mann posted:

It's over, the thread is over, lock it forever.

PerrineClostermann posted:

Jesus could you imagine talking to this guy at a bar? At work? At school?

It'd be loving insufferable.

Space Flower posted:

I find it hilarious how many people were underwhelmed by UBW coming into it having only seen F/Z.

If I had to recommend a show to someone who enjoyed Madoka, it'd probably be Mawaru Penguindrum. My first thought when I started watching it was that I was watching an anime Mother 3. This only reinforced itself as the show progressed.

Torquemadras posted:

What the gently caress

Lestaki posted:

Kamijou is a pretty interesting character because he ends up being Sayaka's kryptonite but everything he does is understandable given his position so it's not as if he's exactly to blame. Indeed, it would detract from the theme that Sayaka was being self-defeating if he was overtly a bad person.

But that wouldn't make much of a jokey joke about superheroes

Sharkopath posted:

Yah theres a bunch of small hints about her still being a witch or at least having a true form as one, that I don't remember because its been a while since I've seen rebellion.

Torquemadras posted:

Wait, wait, wait... Okay. Major incoming.

We know that there are at least three instances of Sakaya turning into a witch. We see two during the various timelines before Madoka's wish (and there's presumably many more, as Sakaya never seems to survive until Warpurgisnacht and probably becomes a magical girl in many, if not all timelines). Then, after Madoka's reset, the entire universe plays out again, and Sakaya turns into a witch yet again, only nobody knows because she's immediately whisked away to Madokaland and/or mercy-killed.

So, which Sakaya is it in Rebellion, given how she apparently knew Madoka before being witchnapped, AND remembers her relation to Kyoko from the TV series?

Is she from the original timeline? If Madoka witchnaps witches from all possible timelines everywhere, does this mean there's an infinite army of Sakayas in Madokaland? Do they kinda merge after death into one soup of witchiness? Or is the Rebellion Sakaya the one from the Wraith universe at the very end of the series? We know Mami and Kyoko are from there, and memories from the original timeline kinda leaked into their heads (like Wraith-universe Kyoko suddenly remembering witches and whatnot). Maybe the same happened to Wraith-Sakaya?

It felt a little lazy to me to bring her back like that, but whatevs, it's nice to see the character getting over her utter and complete devastation in the series. Good thing Homura pushed the universe reset button, though.

TL;DR:

Torquemadras posted:

You know, it's not even that the explanation is so hosed up. Actually, I think it's pretty cool to make mage killer bullets out of your own ribs. But the detailed explanation was... well... incredibly stupid. That's what I was so surprised about. It's magebabble, the sillier cousin of technobabble, taken to extremes. I... really don't think it works. It's like trying to appear smart after the fact. Just because you spend a paragraph detailling your magic science, it does not make it NOT incredibly contrived and oh so convenient for just the right moment. It's like playing Magic The Gathering, only the rules are made up afterwards. Someone described it as Calvinball...

In short: while a badass concept, I think it was handled horribly in the anime, and the detailed (light novel?) explanation strikes me as unnecessarily convoluted and contrived. It's not smart. I was going WTF over the entirely unneeded details...
No offense, Lord Justice, I'm pretty sure it's described exactly like that the light novel...

I'm really not squeamish about those sorts of concepts, they tend to fall of the scale and become hilarious again

Also, Lord Justice, that's a really nice observation about the dialogue! I love how Rider keeps dispensing sage advise while giving zero fucks.

Lord Justice posted:

Lestaki posted:

Ferretts posted:

Here's hoping I can sell this to a friend and pick at the perspective of a girl raised on old Sailor Moon.
I'm thinking of using the Hall Om Mig/Princess Tutu approach with this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kJMHjaE47c0 (Rebellion Spoilers)

Pyrotoad posted:

You missed one. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnZ308WYKnk

Ferretts posted:

Devil's Game 1.0 is better. 2.0 cut the Madoka/Homura post Wally fight dramatic climax scene. Spoilers or no spoilers, that was the highlight of the video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61qXcPjs5So

Torquemadras posted:

Pretty sure she did.

I love that whole sequence of episodes. It's so wonderfully hosed up. When I watched this show, I was at first slightly intrigued, and thoroughly hooked by the end of episode 3; but the moment that really convinced me was at the end of that one scene, where Sakaya fights the freaky many-armed black and white witch. Kyubey just mentions before that one could theoretically weaken the connection to their remote-controlled bodies to dull their sense of pain. And she does just that while stabbed by the arms, going "ahahaha he was right I don't feel ANYTHING" and rips that witch apart

Incredible.

Lestaki posted:

Starsnostars posted:

Sayaka really dodged a bullet there.

Torquemadras posted:

Homura's actions towards the end as well as her true motivations are awesome, make sense and elevate an already incredible movie to a worthy sequel to the series

I mean, as much as there is to love, without that twist it doesn't feel like a story that really needs to be told. Everything returns to status quo (except Homura gets mercy-killed), it's revealed Kyubi knows about Madoka, the end. It already felt a little cheesy how ALL YOUR FAVORITE CHARACTERS ARE HERE, EVEN THE DEAD/ASCENDED ONES, but nevermind that. I hope if there's ever a new series/movie (and there better be, we still know fuckall about wraiths and they went to all that effort to make a continuation even make sense), they don't somehow feel obliged to keep everyone around forever. I very much enjoyed how downright mean and relentless the series could get towards its characters (one of the things I also really enjoyed about Fate/Zero), so I hope they keep that up!

...if there's ever a new series

Torquemadras posted:

Well, if he DOES stay onboard, this would at least guarantee the mean-spiritedness against the characters

I can't imagine another series without Urobuchi, Shinbo or Kajiura - and that's just the people I immediately recognized from their other works. It's still mind-blowing how good almost every single facet of the original series is. That's what worried me about the Rebellion movie, actually. There just seemed to be no room whatsoever for a proper continuation of the story, and the signs of being caught in the usual "unnecessary sequel" trappings appeared pretty soon. In the end, I think they avoided almost all of that (might be Urobuchi was especially aware of that danger?), but I don't think the same trick will work twice. For another series, I hope they find some other way to provide somewhat of a fresh start to avoid sequel baggage. Hell, they already have convenient universe reset / amnesia all around / a new and yet unknown enemy phenomenon... I think a new cast / general cast-cleanup is in order. (Not that I expect or want GRIMDARK KILL'EM ALL...)

Let me tell you about my important thoughts about the Madoka franchise *foams at mouth*

Jagchosis posted:

I didn't think about the class implications of that lecture (moreso focused on how hosed Sayaka was saying something that self righteous) but yeah this reinforces Sayaka being worst Madoka

Middle class girl lecturing a homeless orphan for stealing to survive

Lord Justice posted:

It's the Steins;Gate method of shifting World-Lines given Urobuchi's comments on the matter.

From the wiki:

"According to an interview in Otona Anime Vol. 20, translated by symbv, here is what Gen Urobuchi said on more of Homura's power: "The weapon that looks like Homura's shield is actually a sand timer. When the flow of the sand is blocked, time is stopped. And when there is no sand on the upper part of the sand timer and then the timer is reverted, one month's worth of time is turned back. But before that stage is reached, only time stopping is possible. This means the special power of Homura is the ability to manipulate one month's time's worth of sand in the sand timer. As for the time passed and then turned back, since it was not the focus in this work I did not think it through very thoroughly. I think you can say that the world split up and became parallel worlds there.""

I.E, Homura going back in time alters the "Divergence Factor" (this being the number assigned to a World-Line, such as 0.571024α) of the World-Line enough to shift it over into a new one which has different actions and consequences from the one she left. This explains why Kyousuke played the guitar instead of the violin in Loop 3, and why Oktavia's familiars were dancing Hitomis.


They're secret friends.

Lord Justice posted:

There's two methods of time travel in Steins;Gate, and Homura is using the latter version in pretty much the exact same way. When Okabe Time Leaps, he's also shifting World-Lines, we just don't get the effect because it's a present action from his perspective, instead of a past action like the D-Mails. You're correct that Kyousuke playing the guitar doesn't make sense; which is why I prefer the Steins;Gate theory because you can end up in World-Lines which have radically different inputs even aside from your own intervention, such as with the Omega Attractor Field and Faris' ending specifically.

Lord Justice posted:

This isn't really the thread for it, and I'll just respond one more time and drop it here. If you want to continue the discussion, I'd be happy to do so through PMs.

The shifting of WLs is contingent on information being sent from a future point to a past point. Whether it is a D-Mail or Okabe's consciousness, the effect remains the same. Each Time Leap causes the present Okabe to leap into and destroy a past Okabe which exists separately from that present Okabe in an entirely seperate WL by definition. The act of shifting WLs via the sending of information back in time is in itself self-actualizing an entirely new universe, from birth to death, with different inputs as indicated by the Divergence Factor. If the DF is small, then the new universe is probably almost identical to the one he left, but it is still a new universe.

Considering this, Time Leaping should actually increase the DF by a much greater margin, as it is an active actor being sent back, and not just a simple message. As well, Time Leaping can result in major shifts, such as Okabe managing to shift himself entirely from the Alpha Attractor Field to the Epsilon Attractor Field in Linear Bounded Phenogram.

Essentially, shifting universes can result in different inputs outside of the ones created by the interference of sending information back in time. In Homura's case, she ended up shifting into a universe where there was a different input prior to her waking up in the hospital which resulted in Kyousuke playing the guitar.