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Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Klungar posted:

I really want someone with more skill than I to edit one of the trailers for the new Timeless show to have the villain who is traveling through the timeline and changing the past be Barry. Patty is in the show too, it's basically perfect.

Is that why she left the cast? I hope she comes back :ohdear:

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Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Guy Goodbody posted:

I want him to show up in Supergirl. A weird, kinda dark, street-level hero for her to team up with. Basically her Batman

I'd argue for Batwoman instead. An ex-military, distant cousin to Batman who moonlights as a punk partier and is assisted by her father in her operations. There's also the lesbian thing, but it's not super big outside of her backstory

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012
Top is a pretty bad name, but that can be hand waved by the fact that Cisco was under pressure for a name after getting sniped by Wells

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Chokes McGee posted:

It made more sense with the original comics guy whose superpower gimmick was spinning fast and top-based weapons, but going from inducing vertigo to being named Top is... ehnnnn. Maybe she'll get the spinny after her powers evolve, like Caitlyn and frostbite.

Unfortunately, that power set is really dumb, but only marginally so on a different spectrum of dumbness compared to this one. She could be Countess Vertigo instead

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Argue posted:

Confirmed, the crossover is just a 4 hour long let's play with all the actors in character



Also, I guess that makes 6 people who've hijacked Thea's apartment.

Just don't leave Supergirl alone with Sara too long

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Mr Beens posted:

They really need to tone down on the "plinky plonky" music when new Wells (or other character) is doing something whacky. In fact can we just get that thing expunged from all TV? - we know when characters are doing something silly or amusing, as the actors are acting it out in front of us, we don't need some poo poo trope music spelling it out.

Same, but scenes that are heroic, sad or intended to strongly evoke a particular emotion.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Spacebump posted:

So far I think the Flash episode has been the best of the crossover. Legends is probably going to be fun. I wish all of these characters interacted more than once a year. I don't know how they will top this next year.

Crisis on Infinite Earths.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

lotus circle posted:

Oh, my bad. They have the same abbreviations and "JLD" is usually used for the Dark one.

...And plus a Detroit show is even less likely to be made than a Dark one, sadly.

Surprisingly, the only members of that team that haven't shown up are Aquaman, Zatanna, Elongated Man and Gypsy. MM is in Supergirl, Vixen is on LoT and Vibe is on Flash. The Steel on the original team is Hank Heywood III, cousin to Nate. I'd expect if Gypsy made it in, she'd be the New 52 version in some aspect as an individual from an alternate universe running away from a pursuing threat. Elongated Man was referenced in his alter ego in the Flash.

Not impossible as most of the elements are actually available. The problem is putting them together. At the very, least they're less of a strain on the effects budget compared to the JLDark. The Shadowpact would probably be more viable as it'd require less on the effects in exchange for a slight increase in makeup due to Blue Devil and Nightshade (not by much in her regard) as well as figuring out how to do Detective Chimp. I'd prefer a JLI fwiw, but that'll probably never happen for a decade at least unless WB gets it's head out of it's rear end with the grimderp tone of its Justice League movies and goes straight ensemble shenanigans with it ala Guardians of the Galaxy

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Xealot posted:

The ones covering hair don't seem much better to me, tbh. There's a reason every Captain America movie creates a reason for him to pull off that stupid mask as soon as the plot justifies.

Domino masks look cool, though. Arrow costumes are pretty good in general.

Also because the studio is paying top dollar for that actor anyways so they're not going to waste potential face time by having them hidden behind a mask.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

J33uk posted:

And since the failure of the museum was one of the stories on the ticker now we've got to save the community center museum with a dance off!

Edit: Oh my god this is going to be the plot of the musical crossover isn't it.

It might be, it might not be. We do know that the Music Meister is getting a six book deal so either he is REALLY loving charismatic or has some really crazy back story or something.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012
Star(ling) City was originally supposed to be Seattle, I think or at least generic PNW city.


iirc, the map was made by using the the population data in that area where the cities are located rather than by extrapolating from a similar major city. Essentially the creator is dumb, but the thing was made for school.

The Earth being bigger would explain how Kahndaq, Qurac and Bialiya fits in the Middle East and Markovia fits in Eastern Europe.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012
Echoing sentiments, but I feel like Amell were to get included, he should be left as the only one not singing and trying to figure out how to stop everyone else ala Batman in BatB.

They also should've gone more explicit in Music Meister's nature since it's obvious he's a Fifth Dimensional being, but never clearly say or imply it.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012
It's a real shame and it feels like it may be the case of them scrounging a script together at the last minute before filming and stuff out of pressure by fans to make a musical episode.

Having to make the Music Meister some universe hopping imp seems lazy. Give him his BatB powers or some variation and then also the ability to create dimensional portals via singing a note that resonates at a particular frequency and boom! Solved the crossover problem without having to resort to dreams, hallucinations or pocket dimensions. Getting everyone else to sing? gently caress it. It's a musical. Alternatively, he just projects a psychic field that makes everyone start singing.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK posted:

Abra Kadabra owned and I hope he comes back.

I hope he appears in Legends to really gently caress with Thawne

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Scyantific posted:

DeVoe, aka The Thinker.

People are already speculating that he's the season 4 big bad.

Seems like it might be an interesting bad guy for a season long villain. I assume they'll make him the mastermind type of villain orchestrating things behind the scenes with shittons of contingencies. I imagine they'll try and incorporate his thinking cap in some not terrible way too.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Guy A. Person posted:

Actually I keep thinking about this episode and I want to gush about Abra Kadabra some more. They really did nail him, and this was my favorite episode in awhile precisely because we had a compelling, recurring (I hope) Flash villain.

That really has been what's missing from this season. It's a vast improvement over season 2 but LoT has cannibalized 3 of the best recurring villains (Cold, Heatwave and Thawne) and while we did get a decent Grodd 2-parter we only saw like a 10 second glimpse of the Trickster. And Mirror Master and Alchemy were let downs. We need our good, hammy villains to show up every couple episodes; Savitar is cool enough as a massive existential threat but we need the fun recurring villains too.

It's so weird too because that is exactly what was great about Johns' run on the comic - he resurrected the concept of the Rogues and their story arc was almost as prominent as the Flash and his friends. You would think as an executive producer this would be the main thing he would hammer home as being important.

I would hope that once Mark Hamil was finished with his Star Wars commitments, he'd come back to do more Trickster stuff.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Carlosologist posted:

I just caught up with the show, and I have to say, it wasn't a bad run of episodes. Really looking like Savitar is a rogue Future Barry. The musical episode was really close to perfect, it just could have used more than five songs. Wanted more of Barrowman's wonderful singing voice :allears:

If they do a musical episode next year, it should be with Legends and all of them singing in character including whoever's still left in the Legion

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

nine-gear crow posted:

It'll be 5 shows next year if Black Lightning gets a series pick up (which of course it will. If they greenlight someone as batshit crazy on its head as Legends of Tomorrow, Black Lightning's a shoe-in).

Is this really a thing? I assume the pitch includes Thunder and Lightning (maybe renamed) but where is it supposed to be?

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

nine-gear crow posted:

It certainly is. The pilot's already in production and could probably land in Legends' old Thursday timeslot. Apparently the pitch for the pilot is that Jefferson Pierce (man that's gonna get confusing if he ever meets Jax) comes out to retirement and becomes Black Lightning again after his daughters start stirring poo poo up and getting in trouble with the law by experimenting with their powers -- one's trying to become a vigilante like her father was, while the other is being courted to join a local criminal gang.

It's basically Super Hero Dad.

I assume we'll have more info on it fairly soon as the CW's supposedly going to be announcing what its Fall schedule is going to look like and its pilot pick ups in the next few weeks.

Hopefully they have him in the costume and goggles without the beard. Black Lightning is an interesting character, but outside of his daughters, I'd have to see his supporting cast and villains to get an idea of how good it might be. I know he was recently paired up with Blue Devil for a miniseries for some random reason

Also this makes me continue to mourn the death of Dwayne McDuffy and that we're not getting a series based on Milestone properties (like Static).

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012
One of the best Flash issues I've ever read was 100% about Thawne and his origin story (pre Flashpoint). If he ever comes back, they just need to do that issue since it was hauntingly hosed up but made him seem a little pitiable.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Chokes McGee posted:

I still like the show and think it's fun but the writing has gone completely off the rails. I'm willing to gleefully shout SPEEDFORCE to handle all the ridiculous comic book bullshit, but there's no real excuse for making everyone bone stupid in this episode.

He's already in the future. There's literally no reason he can't cruise back to scientist lady on his way back through time and go "sup now that you're done how does this doohickey work."

The writing's completely fallen apart at this point. I don't know how they fix this, because after Savitar's dealt with, there's not a whole lot of options for villains that aren't retreads. Eobard's the only good option imo and he's currently busy not existing, so.

Next season's big villain is rumored to be The Thinker.

Also you forgot the best villain: The Trickster (Hamil) who's largely unavailable due to another commitment where one co-star got killed off and another died IRL.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

muscles like this! posted:

Black Lightning would probably be kind of hard to fold into the CW-verse as the premise is that he used to be a hero and has teenage daughters who also have powers and that's why he's picking it back up.

It'd be easy enough to fold him into Earth 38. Outside of Superman and Batman, there hasn't been much talk of superheroes in that universe so it's pretty open as to what's allowed there. It makes crossovers harder, but outside of a Crisis event, any reason to pull people over from one universe to another would've been moderately contrived anyways.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

nine-gear crow posted:

I seem to recall there were a couple of one-off Metas in season 1 who were explicitly stated to have been normal-ish people gone bonkers as a result of their powers, but I might be misremembering. The middle stretch of season 1 was a bit of a blur to me.

Also the dude who wasn't Jax in the Firestorm episode from last year lost his loving mind as a result of Caitlyn activating his powers. So there's that too.

In the case of some of them, it's more like they suddenly had access to powers and now could leverage them to get revenge or otherwise use it for their own, illegal or homicidal, benefit. In season 1, at least a good portion of them were already criminals.

Caitlyn is pretty much the odd one out at this point because of the alternate personality.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Medullah posted:

Since it has all of current Barry's memories, it's a time remnant created sometime after tonight's episode. And since they showed the flashback of Emo Flash saying "You'll even create time remnants, and he'll kill them all", they'll most certainly stop Savitar by Barry having a crucial moment where he needs to create a time remanant, and doesn't. Likely some situation involving fire. Show hasn't really done many curveballs and is pretty good about making sure everyone remembers applicable things.

The only real x-factor is the doctor's idea to trap Savitar and how that will play. They focused on the suits with this one - she asked Barry how he avoids chafing in his current suit, and mentioned Savitar's suit shortly after, so that will play a part in the adventure.

Of course, the real question is - if Scary Barry needs the Savitar suit for super speed, why didn't Barry just run and clothesline him when he took off his Power Rangers outfit.

I assume it's because Savitar is still a speedster, but the suit gives him an extra edge

Edit:

GreenNight posted:

Because as we all know, Barry is a moron.

If Oliver had super speed this poo poo would have been solved in two episodes.


Same but also for the recent Supergirl episode.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

8one6 posted:

Right now the ratings are:
Legends of Tomorrow s2 - the best
Flash s1 / Supergirl s1 - A tie for fantastic
Supergirl s2 - great
Flash s3 - Ehh, it's pretty alright
Flash s2 - Dumb, lots pf problems,
Legends of Tomorrow s1 - It was bad, characters were dumb, plot was dump, villain was worse.
Arrow (all) - Cry talking, poor decisions, purestrain CW drama.

Arrow S1, 2 and 5 definitely beat out LoT s1 and maybe Flash s2.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Guy Goodbody posted:

Yes, we all understand the concept of a time loop. Here's the problem with saying what's going on in the Flash is a timeloop

When did the siwtchover take place? Savitar existed. Barry created a time remnant to fight Savitar. When did the time remnant takeover being Savitar from the Savitar that already existed when he was created, and what happened to that existing Savitar?

There is no way to answer that question in a way that makes sense

Barry creates Time Remnants to fight Savitar -> Savitar is defeated and a Time Remnant remains -> Time Remnant becomes Savitar and gets trapped in the Speed Force -> Events of S3, Iris Dies -> repeat.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Guy Goodbody posted:

OK, but as I said, that makes everyone in the future's refusal to tell Barry that absolutely insane.

And it leaves the question of when did Iris et al. die, because there's no way to answer that that doesn't gently caress up character motivations pretty bad

The nature of the Time Remnant is the big missing piece. We don't know. It could be a plot hole (possible) or no one actually remembers of knew about the Time Remnant until more than 8 years after Iris dies.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012
There's this weird reversal of competence that's like the inverse ninja law or the storm trooper effect that all of the CW shows except maybe Supergirl has where, in order to balance the fact there's almost a half dozen people on the heroes side, they have to be dumbed down or the villains made hyper competent to even the odds.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Guy Goodbody posted:

It's kinda impressive how much is pointing towards the Flash being a mostly fun show with moments of drama and how hard the creators are working to force it to be a mostly dramatic show with moments of levity

Flash was supposed to e the fun show and Arrow was supposed to be the dramatic show. Somewhere along the way, some of the Arrow tone leaked into the Flash

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Phenotype posted:

You'd think so, but they did a whole stupid fake science thing about it a couple episodes ago where they drew some circles and showed that Savitar exists outside their choices. Except that would mean the memory-scrambler they shot Barry with last episode shouldn't have affected Savitar either, but it did.

Really, its best just not to think about it. Much like Heroes, this show only really makes sense if you treat it like a feel-good story about people with severe mental impairments overcoming their disabilities to do good.

Time travel is hard. The more rules you apply to it, the harder it is to be consistent

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Phylodox posted:

Is Black Lightning in continuity with the other DC shows?

I'd assume so, but they might keep it separate for at least half the season just in case it does poorly. IMO, I don't think there's enough in Black Lightning to go beyond a season that hasn't been tread either by Flash or Arrow unless he starts becoming the old salt amongst the DCCW heroes and that part is played up.

Since the villains are set up to be The 100, Tobias Whale (not to be confused with the other gang leader from Arrow, Tobias Chruch, who is an original character) is probably the big season villain.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Narcissus1916 posted:

Curious to see how Black Lightning shakes out, I read the pilot a month ago and it was... not good.

Female characters in particular were ATROCIOUS. We're talking every woman being written Season 1 Iris levels of awful.

A solid rewrite or three could make it sing, though.

Especially when some of the focus is supposed to be his daughters? Yeesh, that doesn't sound promising.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

STAC Goat posted:

I'm a little disappointed Black Lightning isn't overtly part of the Arrow-verse but realistically that doesn't really mean a lot. As people said, Supergirl wasn't originally either. Either they keep it vague enough that they can reveal down the line its Earth 1 (or Supergirl's, I guess) or they can make it another Earth. I just kind of liked the idea of Black Lightning being an East Coast hero so being separated from Arrow by an entire country and maybe drawing Vixen in. But ah well. Better its left to find its own footing, I guess.

Apparently Central City is in Missouri? I would not have guessed that.

Black Lightning's original stomping grounds was the Southside of metropolis a.k.a. Suicide Slum (based off of the Lower East Side). It could totally take place in the Supergirl universe with Pierce being extra angry at Superman.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

STAC Goat posted:

The funny thing is it was a fairly good portrayal of Hawkman. He's just usually a creepy rear end in a top hat.

Recent DC has vaguely rehabilitated him (partially by not having him lean on his relation to Hawkgirl/woman since she doesn't really exist anymore) into a hardass berserker ex-cop

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

thebardyspoon posted:

Well no, they'd be doing it to try and make money or assemble a machine (or the classic, send a costumed freak to rob a place that'll attract the flash while you have a couple goons rob the real thing on the other side of town). Definitely no "I need to make the Flash a better hero" or whatever, my ideal season 4 Flash villain wouldn't really be obsessed with the Flash, maybe he just sees him as an obstacle that you need to plan around.

It'll all just be an escalating series of Xanatos gambits culminating in a city/reality wide Rube Goldberg machine meant to kill the Flash or make DeVoe master of the universe or something finale worthy

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Drifter posted:

So who is Godspeed, and what is his villainous motivation?

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/August_Heart_(Prime_Earth)

quote:

August Heart is the detective partner of Barry Allen. August was the only witness to Barry's accident, that turned him into the Flash. While going after a criminal organization called the Black Hole, August was struck by lightning during a Speed Force storm in Central City. He became the Flash's "partner", but in secret, August became the ruthless vigilante known as "Godspeed", and got his revenge on who he suspected to be his brother's killer.

August Heart is a colleague of Barry's whose brother was murdered by a career criminal and his killer was let free due to insubstantial evidence and the destruction of said evidence when Barry and his lab were struck by lightning.

Edit: The only ostensibly good thing to come out of this is that during the Speed Force storm that created a bunch of new speedsters (and then killed a bunch of them), one went onto the New Superman comic as a Chinese Flash to fight alongside a Chinese Superman, a Chinese Batman and a Chinese Wonder Woman.

Xelkelvos fucked around with this message at 13:21 on Jun 2, 2017

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Humbug Scoolbus posted:

As long as Guy Gardner is nowhere near it, I'm fine with that.

Why do you hate fun?

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Guy Goodbody posted:

As long as the movie makes it clear that Stewart is a better Lantern and has more willpower than Jordan, I'm fine with that.

If it's matching current canon, Stewart is the better Lantern member (i.e. can lead and organize and command effectively), but Jordan is more powerful.

Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

No Butt Stuff posted:

This is literally no way he becomes a villain. His redemption arc took all of 10 minutes and I can't see any reason they could come up with the make him a bad guy again.

The only way is if Ollie is trying to hide or otherwise separate Deathstroke from his son for whatever reason.

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Xelkelvos
Dec 19, 2012

Shaddak posted:

Yeah, that entire show feels like a series of hold my beer moments, and yet it works.

That's because it's superheroic idiots doing it and each engages in a different flavor of it while completely earnest and honest about it.

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