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gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

Flytrap posted:

Waitwaitwaitwait, does Nezha's spikes pin targets? I thought all synthesis and capture targets were immune to all CC.

When I've tried spearing them with Nezha it lasts for 4s then wears off and the synthesis target becomes immune to any further CC. It's good for maybe 2 scans before Benny Hill time.

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gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

McKilligan posted:

So, does anyone want to do 'An Idiot's guide to Orbing'? I fumbled through one last night and we managed to bring it down, but it was a slog. I've go Dolon runs down to a science, but I still haven't worked out all the Orb Mother's bag of tricks. What I've gleaned so far:
  • The Orb cycles through Resistances, so your party should have varied damage types on their arc-guns.
  • The Orb's sections are armored, so should the prefferred damage type be corrosive or radiation?
  • I've only got the default arc-gun, and the Velocitus. Which is the preffered weapon vs. the Orb? A Madurai focused Chroma seems like it would make good use of the Velocitus more than the others, unless I'm mistaken.
  • I've got no idea what triggers the invulnerability phases or what you're supposed to do during them.
  • What frames are particularly good? Chroma is an obvious choice, but what else?
  • At least 1 party member should be dedicated to clearing adds, since the arc-guns have a huge cooldown.

  • Archguns are used for hitting the legs/body after the shield is depleted so not necessary to mod them for the resistance mechanic. Radiation does good damage to orb also electric if you can strip its armor completely otherwise shove in whatever damage mods you have
  • Hitting the shields with ________ mode forces the vulnerability to cycle so going for comprehensive coverage isn't super important.
  • Also when you can't hit shields it's a good time to clean up the troops on the ground cause they can get out of hand.
  • Heavy Ammo Restores drop from the guys carrying archwing weapons and look like big ammo boxes on the ground. Being able to spot them is important for getting through the leg shooting phase, which is the worst part of the fight.

The fight goes like deplete shield-> legs can be destroyed -> body becomes vulnerable. At 75% body hp 4 pylons spawn making orb invulnerable, look for blue shield bubbles around the area and run inside shoot the pylon. At 50% shields regenerate. At 25% 6 pylons spawn and once they're down a timer starts to finish the fight starting with shields again. I think once you get shields down the last time both legs and body are vulnerable at same time.

100% self-reliant tank frames seem to be the meta for pubbing since everyone scatters all over the place. Rhino/Chroma/Nezha are popular from what I've seen. Also don't bring cats/dogs/moas cause having them going into revive mode constantly makes it more tedious to filter out when you need to actually go pop up a teammate.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

The_Hatt posted:

I have a kohm that's about half mastered with no potato, how should I build it so it's fun to rank up? I keep hearing it's one of the best weapons in the game but it's just hard for me to enjoy right now.

Damage, multishot, elemental damage mods. If you're not getting the opportunity to shoot big clumps of enemies that live long enough for the spool-up to kick in, it's not going to be as impressive. The target dummies that people use to test and rank weapons work like that, which maybe skews its placement on lists. I think it needs a 120% status riven to really be in best weapon territory.

Hek is a good shotgun alternative for blasting through the star chart, especially with the Scattered Justice syndicate mod that you can ask for in clan chat.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

Pipski posted:

i assume a survival arby qualifies for the nightwave 30 min survival mission criteria -- anyone know for sure?

Arby survival is how I got mine done.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

StashAugustine posted:

Duality Equinox, do you use any other powers, and is she good for other things with that build?

You generally use Narrow-Minded with Duality, which tanks range and makes the other abilities not great. You can balance it out some, but I haven't seen a really good generalist build for her. The clone gets buffed specifically for being an npc in the index, and isn't that strong outside of it. Maim tends to outclass anything Duality can do outside of index. The same 2-forma setup will work for both builds though: Duality/Maim.

Avulsion posted:

She's still good, but Wukong is better.

Wuclone has a much tighter leash range. With Equinox you can leave your clone spawn camping enemies while you carry points and hunt down strays.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

milward posted:

Should I go for the max builds here for ESO and Eidolon? https://warframe.fandom.com/wiki/Maximization
Practical builds for both: Onslaught & Eidolon Hunter.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
Adaptation + Redirection + Arcane Aegis is a solid shield tanking combo that works on a lot of frames that don't have a way to be tanky normally. Frames with 300+ base armor or health buffs/restores built into their kit will still want health/armor, but I've found it to be pretty effective for a lot less of an investment than the Arcane Grace + Guardian combo.

gnoma fucked around with this message at 09:19 on Sep 4, 2019

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

StashAugustine posted:

Also am I missing something or can you not customize your venari



also need gene masking kit from market, basic one is 160k credits.

gnoma fucked around with this message at 20:35 on Sep 7, 2019

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
Revenant is the tank/carrier king of index. Mesmer Skin is straight up immunity and doesn't care about enemy damage scaling. Take Rolling Guard to cover the 1-2s window of vulnerability while refreshing stacks and Energy Conversion since you're rolling over an energy pickup anyway. You'll get 12-16 charges per cast, which actually lasts a good while against the limited number of enemies in the game mode. You still rely on your weapon for damage, but if you end up with enough energy you can combo his 1 and his 3 to do 90%+ of an enemies hp as true damage and circumvent the scaling via a second route.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

And Tyler Too! posted:

4 Titanias laying waste to everything and but making them near-invincible to boot.

Razorwing doesn't work with the already existing mod, Aviator, that reduces damage while airborne so it's unlikely the aura will be any different.

The fun mod to combo with aim glide time is Aero Vantage, which allows you to continue hovering at whatever height you started at. And stand still in mid-air if you jump straight up.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

Tulip posted:

How To Optimize For Getting Punched In The Face

I've played around with this a little and I feel like you're missing a lot by not including Arcane Guardian and Adaptation. Basically every frame that comes up with Quick Thinking + Flow on the sheet can hit equivalent EHP values with Arcane Guardian + Vitality and avoid the drawbacks that come with Quick Thinking. And I feel like Arcane Guardian is in the same resource investment ballpark as 3x Umbral, which you're including in your comparison.

The 3x Umbral results would also look way less attractive if they were being compared to Vitality + Adaptation. With another tool that includes abilities and full mods (link) I get, for example, 20k EHP using 3x Umbral Atlas Prime with max rubble vs. 102k EHP with max rubble and Vitality + Adaptation. Adaptation beats the 3x Umbral build at 2 stacks, and will beat out armor stacking by 3-4 stacks in general. It's also way easier to build around.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

Tulip posted:

remind me to look at this when I'm off work, but my initial reaction is skeptical, since empirical tests of Adaptation have gotten only a sliver of its paper utility. Which is part of why I excluded it from the test (the other being that Adaptation is of minimal use for OHKO - which is the thing that EHP is designed to measure).

The worst case for Adaptation is getting shot exclusively by Elite Lancers, which gives only 20% or so actual DR at max stacks. I think that's the only situation where Fiber would often beat it. The numbers I've seen show it giving you 75%+ DR at max stacks against Corpus and Corrupted and 40%-60% DR against most Grineer. I was wrong on the 2 stack thing, and Valkyr, Nidus, Atlas, and Chroma (with Vex Armor) might be edge cases where high base armor lets a full umbral build compete with the worst case scenario for Adaptation, but most frames will still be gaining more EHP from partial Adaptation stacks than what they'll reach with an armor mod.

Since you're just looking at surviving one shots with base stats, though, I agree it can be ignored. Personally I've found Vitality + Arcane Guardian + Magus Repair to be the sweet spot for staying alive on most frames and Adaptation to be the best option for improving tank frames, so seeing them excluded seemed kind of off at first glance.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

aegof posted:

Somebody effortpost about Baruuk, please, because I have not been feeling him.

Baruuk's innate damage resistance is absurd. 90% from his 3, up to 50% from losing restraint, and 40% while he has serene fists out. Investing in defense mods on top of that gives him sky high effective health, from the hundreds of thousands up to about two million if you go hard enough. If you want to chill out in the Ropapolyst laser or afk sortie 3 ambulas in between drop ships, he's your guy. His exalted fists ignore walls and are devastating for the majority of content in the game. His drawbacks are his 1 & 2 sucking and his fists not scaling against armored, level 100+ enemies. Also your companion will die all the time because percent damage resist isn't shareable.

To build him you want 225%+ strength, neutral-ish range and efficiency, and are encouraged to dump duration. He can tank using any of health, shields, or energy. Energy is his highest base stat and Quick Thinking gives him the highest effective health, but energy is generally harder to regenerate than health or shields. I prefer shield tanking with Redirection, Adaptation, and Arcane Aegis. The flat regeneration from Arcane Aegis is significantly better than the percent hp you get from Arcane Grace, due to low base health, and is easier to maintain with its 20s duration. Health tanking works fine and is the go to route without arcanes, just be sure to stick with Adaptation because you won't be getting anything out of fiber mods.

Shield Tank Build (3 forma)

Tennoware

For a health tank, swap Redirection for Vitality and Arcane Aegis for Arcane Guardian and Arcane Grace if you have them. Any extra sources of regeneration like Magus Repair or Magus Elevate will go a long way. Umbral Vitality isn't worth the forma and capacity hit considering his low base hp. The strength gives 23 daggers from his 3. Streamline and Stretch are flex slots, ready to be swapped out if/when he gets decent augment mods. Enemy radar in the exilus is very useful with the whole punching through walls thing.

Desert Wind (5 forma)

Tennoware

5 forma and 4 legendary mods is a weighty build, but you really feel the difference from having it maxed out. Sticking with a lower investment build will still feel fine, but leave you relying on your guns a little more often. When downgrading stick with raw damage, crit, and attack speed. Status is very low value, set mod bonuses don't work, and reach only effects the actual punches, not the waves.

Elude, his 1, is rarely worth using. It cripples your energy regen options due to being a channeled ability and both deactivates its defensive effect and doubles in energy cost whenever you fire a weapon, which is really bad. While dodging stuff with Elude is good for eroding restraint, having it active at the same time as his 3 will double the range of the disarming daggers which creates negative synergy as the disarmed enemies switch from spraying you with bullets to walking over for slow melee hits. It's also just not necessary to dodge stuff when the other parts of Baruuk's kit give him extreme mitigation with little to no drawback.

Lull is technically a crowd control ability, but functionally it's used with highly negative duration to turn energy in to restraint loss. It puts enemies to sleep, which is a weak control effect, and is both blocked by line of sight and unable to be recast until the previous instance wears out. Modding for low duration reduces the recast timer and enables its use as a spammable restraint eroder in crowds.

Desolate Hands is Baruuk's bread and butter ability. The daggers grants 90% damage resistance at or above 9 stacks and fire off frequently to disarm enemies and erode restraint. You might be tempted to dump range to hold on to stacks longer, but it's better to keep range at a decent level and benefit from the passive restraint erosion. 225% strength gives you 18 daggers and surpassing that mark is the ideal way to maintain stacks without having to recast too often. Daggers will also spread to teammates (but not companions) for half of your total capacity, so hitting 18+ lets you share up to the full 90% damage resistance amount.

Serene Storm is the the payoff for eroding restraint with your other abilities. You get exalted fists that fire off giant energy pulses that ignore walls and generally make a mess of enemies. Slam attacks, slide attacks and a few other combos have built in CC effects that are underwhelming. Mostly you're firing off single hits or short combos that mulch through everything in the direction you're facing. The fist weapon itself has sky high crit chance, but abysmal status chance that prevents it from making good use of Condition Overload and scaling against very high level enemies. It also only increases combo counter from point blank hits, which is another limit on its scaling.

Putting all the pieces together, his playstyle looks like:
1. Put daggers up at the start of the mission and refresh below 9 stacks.
2. Shrug off damage and shoot stuff as restraint erodes.
3. Pull out fists after awhile for mass murder fun times.

He excels at brute forcing any kind of tank check, but there's no place in the game where that is especially rewarding. He's still a strong general purpose frame because he has outstanding tools for both staying alive and killing lots of stuff, which is the most basic goal of the game. Like pretty much all tanks he can handle all of the games common content when paired with a strong weapon.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

BurntCornMuffin posted:

Put my first prime (Saryn) in the oven. What are some good builds? At first glance, I feel like maximizing range is a solid plan for those spores.

My Build - 3 Forma, some maxed late game mods. Arcanes and/or Magus Repair to sustain hp.

Saryn Lite - 1 forma build with Regenerative Molt. Forma is just to let you slot Corrosive Projection.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

Ytlaya posted:

Are there any good fist weapons? I'm leveling a fist weapon currently and the animations are fun. The weapon itself can apparently be used to craft another weapon that steals health on crits (which I can craft, though it uses Nitain Extract and I might want to avoid spending too much of that since I'm limited to what I'm getting from Nightwave).

Kogake and Hirudo are actually sparring weapons. They come with leg attachments and their stances use both punches and kicks. Fist weapons are Tekko, Ankyros, Furax and have their own punchy stances/animations. Neither category is amazing compared to other melee types but you can definitely make them work. The stats for both types scale pretty linearly with MR so the highest one you have access to should perform best. Claws are also kind of similar and might perform slightly better because their stances have better procs. Venka Prime is super good but got its MR increased to 14 with the melee update so it may be a long ways off for you.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

LITERALLY MY FETISH posted:

Whipclaw is mainly a trap because you can do an insane amount of damage to a single target with a bunch of setup and multiple targets with even more setup, but so can a lot of other frames, and they can do it faster. Her unique strength is being a durable fast melee CC god.

I think you're missing something with Whipclaw. It does damage in an area by default, can be spammed more or less indefinitely, and will easily out damage melee. There is no setup to it, you just press 1 over and over and kill everything in 10 meters of where your cursor is.

Whipclaw inherits mods from Khora's equipped melee weapon and you want to build strictly high crit + raw damage to maximize its potential. With the right riven you don't need to worry about using any mod slots on the frame itself to turn Whipclaw into pure death.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

LITERALLY MY FETISH posted:

Whipclaw does a lot of damage, for sure. It's just not a very good way to use khora because in doing so you're limiting how far you can push the other stats that make her CC and survivability really good.

It makes her one of the top 3-4* frames in the game for clearing missions. She won't beat Saryn, Volt, or Mirage in Onslaught or Defense, but for every other mission type Whipclaw turns her into one of the very best damage frames. If you think fragor prime jump slams can compete with it for dps, range and ease of use, then you likely haven't experienced Whipclaw at its full potential. I like her CC options and I agree you can make strong builds using them. I use a 250 power strength Strangledome build to mostly afk 30 minute Kuva Survivals. But warframe is a game where damage trumps crowd control by a large margin and that makes Whipclaw incredibly useful (and fun) and the exact opposite of a trap.

* The other frames I'd rank at the top for general purpose damage are Mesa and melee Wisp/Gauss. Titania and Baruuk are close but less straightforward to use. Then Gara, Volt, Saryn, Revenant, and Equinox who can mass murder but have ramp up times and caveats that can slow them down when running end to end through corridor missions. New Ember probably fits in somewhere but I haven't put much time into her yet.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

Captain Oblivious posted:

Alright it's been a while since I've played, can someone give me a bullet point on what's changed in melee for someone who obsessively melees goddamn near everything? I tended to use a knife zaw to knife everything to death on Ash and am figuring out what if anything needs changing on my mod layout :v:

A fast knife zaw won't work the same under the new system. Daggers don't have the forced finisher combos anymore. Covert Lethality is still a thing to some degree so if you're just using the dagger for Fatal Teleport it might still work.

The biggest mod changes were to Condition Overload and Blood Rush scaling. They used to get calculated after other stats, which made them absurdly strong, but now get added in at the same time which puts them in a more reasonable spot. They're both still very competitive with their alternatives.

The skeleton for building melee generally revolves around the following mods:

Damage: Condition Overload or Primed Pressure Point
Crit: Blood Rush or Sacrificial Steel
Crit Damage: Organ Shatter
Reach: Primed Reach
Attack Speed: Berserker, Primed Fury
Status: Primed Fever Strike and 60/60 mod to taste
Combo Duration: Drifting Contact
Heavy Attacks: Corrupt Charge, Amalgam Organ Shatter, Killing Blow

Condition Overload will beat Primed Pressure Point when you're attacking against 2+ status effects. Melee procs status pretty well due to stances having guaranteed procs on top of procs you'd get naturally from the weapon, making Condition Overload a pretty reliable Pressure Point replacement. Having both mods isn't awful, but you'd want to make sure you're getting the most out of your other stats before stacking them.

Blood Rush hits 660% crit chance at 12x combo and Sacrificial Steel gives 220% flat. If you're dedicated to clearing missions with melee, the combo requirement for Blood Rush is a pretty low bar to meet and the extra 440% crit is obviously very valuable. Sacrificial Steel is still pretty reliable and great to have on weapons that you're only pulling out intermittently. Sacrificial Steel and other non-Blood Rush crit mods give double their bonus on heavy attacks and will work better for that type of build.

I haven't mentioned Sacrificial Pressure up to this point. That's because it has kind of iffy value. Even with the set bonus, dual Sacrificial mods end up slightly behind Primed Pressure Point + Sacrificial Steel for general use and will fall further behind when compared to Condition Overload. The set bonus does perform better when using heavy attacks, where the boosted crit gain will do enough to outweigh the loss in raw damage. But even then you're only looking at a 4%-8% increase over Primed Pressure Point + Sacrificial Steel. I wouldn't say it's especially bad to use Sacrificial Pressure as your general damage mod, because the overall differences are fairly marginal either way, but it's hard to outright recommend it given the endo cost and the extra forma you'll likely need to use on every weapon in order to fit it.

Primed Reach is great for weapon feel. It's no longer % based and adds the same +range regardless of weapon type, which lets it work well across the board. It's not always a strict damage increase and can be dropped if you're running out of space for other stuff you want, but personally I don't like running without it.

How much attack speed you want will come down to personal taste. I find running double attack speed mods works really well. If just using one, Berserker will win out with the higher total value. If you don't like the ramp up Primed Fury is still fine.

Primed Fever Strike is a great primed element mod to have because all 3 elements that toxin combines into are good. Corrosive is great against armor and is always safe to build for. Viral is strong when you're only getting a small number of procs on enemies before they die, either because you're killing them in few hits or because you have low status chance and just aren't getting many procs. Gas can work well when you're getting a lot of hits in with a high status weapon, simply because every proc is guaranteed to contribute damage.

Drifting Contact is mainly a quality of life bonus that will compete for the final slot on a weapon. It gets the most value when used alongside Blood Rush, due to the increased importance of maintaining a high combo counter.

Heavy attack builds want to get the most value out of mashing the heavy attack button over and over. One of the new stats that benefit this play style the most is +Initial Combo, which makes it so that the number of hits in your combo never drop below your Initial Combo value. Corrupt Charge is the go to mod for Initial Combo and Fragor Prime is notable for being a weapon with Initial Combo built in. Amalgam Organ Shatter and Killing Blow both speed up the wind up time on heavy attacks and, like attack speed, it's personal taste whether you want to use both. Wind up speed doesn't completely replace attack speed for heavy attacks either, the wind up is followed by an actual swing that still benefits from attack speed.

Putting all the pieces together we can get a standard-ish build (and an impatient build) for spamming regular attacks that looks like this:
1. Condition Overload (Primed Pressure Point)
2. Blood Rush (Sacrificial Steel)
3. Primed Reach
4. Berserker
5. Primed Fury
6. Primed Fever Strike
7. 60/60 Electric (Voltaic Strike)
8. Organ Shatter
9. Drifting Contact

That's obviously 9 slots, so something is going to have to get cut. The three weakest mods are generally going to be Drifting Contact, Primed Fury, and Organ Shatter. The decision of which to axe will vary between weapons. Drifting Contact is a safe drop in most cases, especially when not using Blood Rush or when not worried about status. Primed Fury (or Berserker if you prefer Fury's flat bonus) is also a mostly safe drop since the weapon will still have another attack speed mod to fall back on. Organ Shatter is usually the worst option to cut, but on a low crit weapon (less than about 17%) it can make sense. And it's actually not terribly important which 8 mods you end up using, just because melee is in a strong enough state that any reasonably well built weapon will shred face.

A sample heavy attack build would look like this:
1. Primed Pressure Point
2. Sacrificial Steel
3. Amalgam Organ Shatter
4. Primed Reach
5. Corrupt Charge
6. Primed Fever Strike
7. 60/60 Cold (Vicious Frost)
8. Killing Blow or Berserker or Primed Fury or Life Strike

The last slot is personal preference as is the flavor of the 60/60 mod, which can even be replaced. Life Strike isn't a damage dealing option, but the very reliable healing can be nice to have. Condition Overload is still a decent option, especially on a weapon with a multi-hit heavy attack like a Machete.

Another thing that's changed is each weapon type has a set Follow Through value that you can see in the arsenal (or on the wiki.) On any given swing you'll always do full damage to the first enemy hit, Follow Through represents a damage multiplier that is applied to any additional damaged enemies. Smaller weapons like daggers and fists have the most favorable Follow Through value, only taking a 10% penalty. Larger weapons get hit harder, taking a 40%-60% penalty. This doesn't matter a lot for standard combo attack spamming, since you're bouncing between enemies pretty quickly anyways, but can be noticeable when fighting crowds with heavy attacks. Even then, I don't think it's as bad as it first sounds.

For rivens, it's hard to say definitively what's best this early into the rework. Reliable stats like +Damage, +Crit Chance, and +Toxin are going to retain their value. Personally, I'm leaning towards +Crit Damage,+Attack Speed, +Combo Duration, and +Reach because those tend to be the most underwhelming mods on any given weapon and I think the potential to condense them down and take up even one fewer slot is pretty valuable. Finisher Damage and Slide Crit seem like the safest negatives to have.

Melee is also plenty viable without the rare and high endo cost mods that I'm using as examples. It's safe to downgrade all the options to their non-Primed, non-Sacrificial base versions and still have great results. The mods that are going to take the biggest hits when downgrading are Reach and Fury. I might still want Reach on low base range weapons like Daggers, but for things like Staves and Polearms and even Dual Swords I'd seriously considering dropping it if I had an option for more direct damage. Base Fury just isn't that strong, and I'd place a lot of value into obtaining a copy of Berserker if I didn't have the Primed version. Gladiator Vice is another option with the same attack speed value and drain as Fury that also has a set bonus to boost crit based on combo multiplier.

Overall, it's hard to go wrong in the new melee system as long as you're putting an iota of thought into your mods. The big thing the rework did was raise the performance floor and that's created a lot of leeway in how things can be built. The ceiling was also lowered. Obsessively min-maxed setups aren't going to vastly outperform their counterparts. It's pretty safe to dive in and experiment and come up with fun personal builds. Melee 3.0 just in general works well and is good.

gnoma fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Nov 23, 2019

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
Gauss and Wisp are extremely good melee frames. The attack speed + move speed combo from their buffs is perfect for both mowing through and moving between packs of enemies. They also both proc status passively through Shock Mote (Wisp) and Redline's missiles (Gauss) and have on demand status procs from their 3s which is great for Condition Overload. Both have solid defense options. For me, no other frames are as perfect of a fit for grabbing a couple pointy sticks and blenderizing levels.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
Putting defensive Umbral mods onto Baruuk is fairly inefficient. His base stats are 225 hp and 150 armor. Upgrading to 3x Umbral from base Vitality and Steel Fiber is worth 248 health and 124 armor. He already has essentially 3000+ armor built into his kit. Replacing Fiber with Adaptation is a net +500 armor practically and +2400 in ideal cases. The +22% strength gain is worth 2 extra daggers on his 3 and mostly irrelevant with what you're already gaining from corrupted mods. Baruuk won't die during Adaptation's ramp up so running with it and Vitality is reliable and maintains build flexibility while letting you hold onto those couple extra forma.

gnoma fucked around with this message at 20:38 on Nov 26, 2019

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
Saryn is a strong frame, but her popularity comes from how easy she is to build more than her power. She gets outperformed by at least a couple other frames in all forms on content. The difference is that even an inefficient Saryn build will eventually murder everything because of how favorably her spores scale.

On the last devstream they had a graph showing play rate of champions across all MRs since the old blood patch (link.) The most popular frames were Inaros, Saryn Prime, Wukong Prime, and Mesa Prime. The one thing those frames have in common is that you would have to go really far out of your way to make a bad build for them. Inaros is always going to be tanky, Wukong is always going to have cloudwalker and extra lives, Saryn and Mesa always murder stuff. They're overplayed because they're pubby proof.

Nerfing Saryn or the others just because they're hard to gently caress up doesn't really make sense though. Warframe doesn't reward min/max builds to any significant degree, so there's no reason to punish frames for having easy/lazy builds.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
After playing a fair bit of everything, this is how I'd give the role breakdown for railjack.

Pilot
Guides the railjack and team through the mission. This means flying to the next set of enemies and to bases, but also watching out for the general state of the mission and making call outs if necessary. Controls the battle avionics, is a dedicated gunner, and has the easiest access to forward artillery. Should pay attention to crew ship spawns and use evasive maneuvers to avoid taking unnecessary damage. If the crew has expressed interest in the slingshot, line that up for them.

When approaching bases, I've found it best to park 4.5k out to avoid the constant ramjet launches and allow everyone to go in and loot. A slingshot will cover almost all the distance if you point it at the door.

Gunner
Sits in a turret and shoot things. Often has split responsibilities and will peel off to deal with boarders, repairs, and launching at crew ships. The first 2 crew ships waves are single spawns, and not a big deal. After that they double up after and become a higher priority for the gunner.

Photor and Cryophon are close range guns that should only really be used in the pilot slot. Apoc and Carcinnox are the go to shredders, with Carcinnox being a bit easier to use. Hunt for easy targets and fire in bursts to manage heat.

Archwing Roamer
Top two jobs are insta-killing crew ships and collecting loot. Chasing fighters 7km from the railjack is the sign of an ineffective archwing player. Should be paying attention to Cy's announcements and jumping on crew ships immediately. Crew ships are the only real threat to the railjack and divert a lot of the crew's attention if they aren't dealt with promptly. Archwing is great for looting, with more freedom of movement and field of view than the pilot. Stay near the railjack or other archwings to hold the fighter swarm together and keep everyone's target density high. If a fighter goes into evade mode, turn around and target something else.

Amesha is the only railjack archwing. Press 4 when you enter space and the first shot that hits you will give full energy. Then press 1 and 3 and you'll be invincible and slow down everything around you, which completely trivializes killing fighters and removes any threat they pose. Having an Amesha 3 centered on the railjack at all times is hugely valuable and should be your priority after taking out crew ships and looting. Phaedra or Imperator Vandal with Rad/Cold and Critical Focus is the archgun meta. Radiation does the best damage, cold gives the best proc.

Bonus Amesha tip: when leveling or forma-ing, spam 2 for extra affinity gain.

Engineer
An engineer manages the forge and makes sure hull failure timers don't hit 0. The important thing to note about hull repairs is that the ship is effectively invincible during the 60 second timer. To maximize your repair juice, you want to complete the hull repair sub 20 seconds and deal with other tasks like boarders, fires, and electrical shorts first. Any time you fill up on repair juice is a good time to hit refine to maximize resource yields. Flux, ordnance, and dome shots may become be useful once people can kit out their ships properly, but probably not.


A lot of the duties for each role are fungible and you can end up doing a little of everything in any given mission. It's still Warframe and being super efficient at all times isn't necessarily the priority. The roles also kind of breakdown in the veil or when doing progression in general. It's way easier to min/max the archwing and archguns than it is the railjack right now thanks to bad drop rates, high repair costs, and rng equipment. Expect to see 3 or 4 people in archwing and the railjack parked out of harms way in higher level missions.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

Mailer posted:

you can shoot from a mile away with ImpV but as soon as the AI movement engages you have to pray it decides to move in a straight line close to you long enough to kill.

If you're having trouble shooting stuff in space that means you're not using Amesha 3, which would be weird because Amesha 3 is the only reason to even be in AW in the first place.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

Iretep posted:

For anyone who is railjacking in the veiland seeing derelicts, to get the reward from the cache in them, you need to not have completed the map before opening it. The cache reward is revealed as a 4th bonus reward on the complete mission screen. Now if youve missed a bunch of rewards because of this, dont worry. The rewards suck. 34% chance to get a spectra vandal part and rest is fresnels and dirac.

When I tested, I got the reward no matter when I completed the mission objectives. There's no pop up, but a fourth reward still showed up above loot drops on the post mission screen after extracting. But like you said the rewards were trash and indistinguishable from what you'd get breaking open a random crate.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
I tested thoroughly a few days ago and it's easy enough to count the rewards on the mission screen. First three will always be like 750x or 1000x resource drops plus the relic or whatever main drop was. Then loot drops will start with oddball numbers like 787x carbides. The cache drop will be a fourth reward drop from the cache table, above the loot.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
Need a Vidar high roll and then 7 or so mods that are Condition Overload level rarity. Definitely feel like a powerhouse once you get there but even then some of the core annoyances (crewship bubbles, identifying and picking up loot) make the overall experience a bit unsatisfying.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
Ivara intrinsic farming uses Sleep Arrow to reset alerted status and hammers to kill the sleeping enemies because they have a strong, multi-hit finisher.

Resetting alert status is necessary because enemies in galleons are alerted by default, and it's hard to avoid alerting enemies in other areas. Sleep Arrow doesn't reset alert status until enemies wake up so you use the first hit of the hammer finisher to do more than 50% of the target's hp and force them awake. The second hit will kill them and grant a stealth affinity bonus. You always hit the finishers from behind because stealth affinity has been bugged since the melee rework and will drop if you try anything else (except for sometimes when you're a client rather than host).

Here are the builds: Ivara, Hammer

There is room for error in both. Overextended and Enemy Radar can work for Ivara. Spoiled Strike can fit on the hammer over Smite, or replace an element that you may already have if you're using Kuva hammer. Shildeg, Fragor Prime, and Arca Triton should all work. I believe Destreza Prime works also.

Doing this in a normal group is pretty troll, since it slows down the mission for everyone else. Ivara on a crewship means it lives forever, spewing out bubbles that grind space combat to a halt. You're asking the group to go along with you contributing nothing as you selfishly farm and leech completion rewards. IMO, go solo and complete or abort as it suits you. Also keep in mind that the high level intrinsics are really bad right now, so you're gaining very little by farming in the first place.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

Sarsapariller posted:

Someone explain the melee meta to me, I was gone for a year and I don't understand it.

Three basic ways to build melee:

Full Combo - Blood Rush + Drifting Contact, sustain the combo multiplier and get huge crits.
Combo Lite - Sacrificial Steel, pull out melee whenever without worrying about ramp up or dropping combo.
Heavy Attack - Sacrificial Steel, +Initial Combo, and +Wind Up Speed. Only uses heavy attacks, ignores combo system.

I've found the linked mod setups to be very widely applicable.

It's fine to downgrade Primed mods to their normal variants except for Primed Fury, which is best replaced by Quickening.

Condition Overload will outperform Primed Pressure Point for combo builds if enemies are living long enough to build up status procs (more than about 3 or 4 hits), but won't work against status immune stuff like Kuva Liches and Crewship reactors.

Faster Heavy Attack weapons like Rapiers can drop Berserker or Primed Fury for Primed Fever Strike.

For choosing between actual weapons you generally want something with hybrid stats and good stance procs. I haven't tried or seen everything but the stand out weapon types I've seen are:

Combo: Dual Swords, Tonfas, Nikanas, Claws, Polearms, Swords, Dual Daggers, Swords and Shields, Heavy Blades
Heavy Attack: Scythes, Rapiers, Two-Handed Nikanas, Whips, Machetes, Fragor Prime

Glaives kind of suck, but the rest of the unmentioned weapon types have at least one good weapon (usually the highest MR one.)

Zaws didn't get buffed. They're still usable with hybrid or crit stats but are mainly still interesting because of Exodias, particularly the energy regen from Exodia Brave.

Sarsapariller posted:

It seems like all the guides on the melee meta are like "This weapon OWNS! Iiiiiiiif you mod exclusively for heavy attacks + bring a specific companion + perform a bunch of attacks to set up the enemy with your status gun or whatever."

Putting Gladiator set mods on Deconstructor w/ Helios is useful if you're going full combo, but isn't make or break. Priming for Condition Overload is no longer a thing.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
How quickly we forget the noble Catchmoon.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
This hotfix feels like it's only half of the actual patch Railjack needed. They took away pretty much everything that was strong previously (Rhino, Winged avionics, Slash procs, Cryophon) and didn't do anything else to improve the flow of missions. Fighter ehp was, and still is, irrelevant versus battle avionics. Hopefully removing the outliers makes the actual needed changes more obvious and there's a part 2 soon. The loot markers at least are a great improvement.

gnoma fucked around with this message at 20:12 on Jan 9, 2020

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
First mission of the day is 2x credit reward. Credit booster can double that to 4x. Don't think smeeta has anything to do with it.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
Magus Lockdown is the gimmick way of killing stuff with operator. It does 60% of the target's hp as puncture damage, and in theory you can one shot anything that doesn't have armor or puncture resist by running 2 copies. It works best vs. Grineer w/ 4x corpro. Corpus and infested typically take a couple extra dashes because shields have puncture resist and infested get damage reduction from ancients.

Void Siphon waybound from Zenurik lets you spam void dash forever if you're hitting 3+ targets. Combine it with a dash upgrade from another school that gets rid of the knockback for best results.

It's pretty mind numbing to kill large numbers of enemies this way, and slower than normal weapons most of the time, so I wouldn't recommend it in general.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
The Desert Wind aug is a relic of the old melee system. Status used to be really important for melee scaling because of old Condition Overload, and 5% on Desert Wind limited how far you could push Baruuk. It makes sense for people in the partner program to have suggested it in that context. It makes a little less sense for DE to release it 6+ months later in an environment where the ability no longer needs status to scale, but getting viral procs on top of the high base damage doesn't sound too awful.

gnoma fucked around with this message at 15:07 on Feb 5, 2020

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
The chain lightning is a cosmetic effect of the Ohma. Telos Boltace has an enemy vacuum on slide attacks and a parkour boost faction proc. Kronen Prime is fast and has a high riven dispo. Can't go wrong with any of the tonfas.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
It doesn't sound like they're doing anything productive with armor. Pubbing higher level stuff should be a little easier, but the number changes they mentioned won't lessen the value of armor stripping at all. 7300 vs. 5800 (the numbers from the stream) is 96% vs. 95% damage reduction. On a 100 Bombard, that's a drop from 1,057,518 to 849,024 effective HP, which is probably noticeable. But 4x corpro will still take that 850k down to 42k, and lets you run viral on everything to halve it again to 21k.

Even the lowest number they mentioned (1400) is still restrictive. Corpro beats Steel Charge at 450/750 enemy armor depending on whether you're using Primed or regular Pressure Point. Basic Lancers hit 750 armor by level 62, which is below the level range they're talking about adjusting. The only way corpro loses value is if they target it and meganerf it, which seems unlikely given how little use it gets from pubbies.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
Giving warframes neutral resistances on armor/shields is a nice buff to both Adaptation and armor. Adaptation's value currently gets scaled down by negative resistances and armor's weakness to puncture means at higher values it starts to gain more from Adaptations % puncture resist than from straight armor increases. Going forward it should work to just put Fiber on armor frames and Adaptation on frames with % DR from abilities and there won't be any weird hidden math tripping things up.

Arcane Energize changing to energy restore over time and potentially becoming incompatible with channeled abilities is gonna negate a lot of the Titania buffing they've been doing for the past 6 months.

Arcane Aegis is getting a huge nerf. Right now it's a stronger, 100% uptime version of Grace for the few frames that can justify using shields. It's turning into a rank 1 Fast Deflection with limited uptime.

This would be a good time for them to make eidolons bearable. Remove the night time requirement. Let you buy deployable lures as a gear item from the quills. Killing Hydrolyst gives you shards to spawn another eidolon of your choice. Turn it into a a bearable focus farm at least if arcanes are gonna be more accessible elsewhere.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

Spudd posted:

Just press 4 again?

Drunkenly slamming into walls and spraying magic fairy bullets everywhere is what makes Titania fun. Having to stop and hide in a corner to try and get energy back isn't fun.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

TheAgent posted:

the only reason people were so die hard about bringing corpro is because armor scaling is absolutely hosed and DE should have addressed it like 3+ years ago

It's also the only aura that's guaranteed to benefit the whole group since it enhances all damage types, not just melee or pistols or whatever. It will continue to be the best until we start spending a disproportionate amount of time fighting corpus or there's a full aura overhaul.

gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.
4x coaction pushes max corpro from 72% to 83%. That's a reasonable EHP difference at high armor levels, and exilus mods do very little in general, so you could probably justify using it. It's not going to be the same answer to armor that old corpro was, so unlikely to be a standard or highly recommended way to build.

Most likely it's going to be a "bring corpro and only use meta weapons" type of situation.

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gnoma
Feb 7, 2005

These poles made from wood, and the crossarms from iron.

sushibandit posted:

It is overkill from that aspect but it boosts the intensify and there's not really much else of value to stick on there.

You will get way more value out of Adaptation than any armor mod on Baruuk. His base health is also low so you're gaining relatively little from Umbral Vitality, especially when it blocks you from slotting an exilus mod. Power Drift (15%) is worth more than what you gain from the umbral set bonus (11%). With the shield changes Redirection + Adaptation (+ Arcane Aegis) is, imo, the most rewarding tank route for Baruuk.

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