Michael Brown Shooting: No probable cause exists to file any charges

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Michael Brown Shooting: No probable cause exists to file any charges

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eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

This is MR. Governor, just reminding everyone that there will be no curfew tonight.

# ¿ Aug 19, 2014 07:18

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# ¿ May 17, 2024 06:11

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

chitoryu12 posted:

At this point I can't even care about the safety of the cops. They've turned into dystopian bad guys.

The only sympathy I have for them is that they likely have families and rely on a paycheck. Its the people running the show I am disgusted with.
Man wouldn't it be awesome if the cops started joining the protest against the cops?

# ¿ Aug 19, 2014 07:41

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

AfterFather posted:

Where are these stories that Michael Brown charged at the Officer with a gun pulled on him come from? Do these people think life is like some kind of loving movie. I really want to fight my coworker right now.

They all come from one anonymous caller to a radio station that claims she heard from Wilson's wife. This caller also said that Wilson recived the dispatch about the robbery during the encounter with Brown which directly contradicts the official PD statement.

Stalin McHitler posted:

Has the fox 2 stream been choppy as hell for everyone else, or is it just me?

All the streams are choppy tonight.

# ¿ Aug 20, 2014 03:29

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

zen death robot posted:

Tim will mooch anything from iPhone cables to freezepops from anyone he can.

This set is non-inclusive, the freezepops are where he draws the line.

# ¿ Aug 20, 2014 04:42

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Strongylocentrotus posted:

I seriously want to know the origin story of the peace train. Where did it come from? Who made it? Why did they make it? Where does it go after the protests? So many questions.

It just materializes where it is needed, after the need is over it vanishes into the ether until one day when it will ride the rails again.

# ¿ Aug 20, 2014 05:15

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

zen death robot posted:

good work on not paying attention to whats going on around you guys

If you heard what they followed up with, I think they misunderstood the question. They said the protesters are getting along fine and people are being nice to them even though they are white. I don't think they were denying this about systemic racism, I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt.

# ¿ Aug 20, 2014 05:31

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

ohgodwhat posted:

I am absolutely confused as to what less lethal could mean. Ade they the guns for killing people or not?

Non-lethal are things like tear gas and LRAD. ITs going to be really unfun, but you won't die. Less-than lethal are things like beanbags, rubber-bullets, and tasers. The intent isn't to kill someone, but its still a possibility if it hits in the right spot.

# ¿ Aug 20, 2014 05:35

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Its pretty hilarious when the military is less militarized and more relaxed than local cops.

# ¿ Aug 20, 2014 16:43

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Pellisworth posted:

I only rewatched a couple times but honestly I don't see either a provocation for the cops to step out of their car and immediately pull their guns, nor do I see a knife. The guy filming on his cellphone and several other people walk by and clearly realize the victim is not "all there" but he's not being violent or making much of a scene. Then the cops pull in guns drawn, the guy says "shoot me shoot me kill me now" and walks towards them, they empty a ton of rounds into him. I didn't see a knife but I suppose he could have pulled something quickly and at close range the cops had no time but to fire.

Still, I really see no reason why they needed to start the confrontation with guns on the guy. Again, seems to be needlessly aggressive toward someone who's clearly not of a sound state of mind.

Edit: no I can hear the cops saying "drop it" several times as he advances, so there's likely a knife pulled. Still, it's just a black dude with two cans of soda (did he steal those??) being agitated on the sidewalk near a bus stop.

Its definitely suicide by cop, you can't try and portray it any other way. The guy steals soda and sets them on ground waiting for cops to show up, he wanted to get shot to prove a point.
I agree that they should have tased him instead, but everything else they did was handled appropriately.

Many witnesses including the one that made the call said he was acting irratic. Yea he was probably not mentally well, but he definitely appeared agitated, unpredictably, and potentially violent before the cops arrived. The cops did not instigate anything here.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 01:39

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Untagged posted:

Why do so many folks seem assume all cops carry tasers or have them immediately available? Many don't. It can be pretty hard to effectively judge a situation in light of not knowing what may or may not have been available to an officer at the time of an incident.

Its not as much that we assume they do as that we assume they should. If they can afford several MRAPs they can afford tasers.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 01:45

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Mr. Glass posted:

I have seen this image countless times and I just now notice the guy protesting for a "larger free speech zone". Man I love AD.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 01:47

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

I still think their initial response is reasonable. If both hands were visible I could see them not drawing their guns and trying to engage in conversation. When a reportedly irrational and unpredictable perp is deliberately hiding his hand, you have to assume its a gun.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 01:51

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Mr. Glass posted:

again, they're not buying them. they're acquired from the feds in the form of a grant.

it's hosed up, but it's true.

I understand your point, but I think it ties into a larger problem.
If the military wasn't excessively spending so much money that they are giving away MRAPs for free, we could probably spend more money on things local PD actually need.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 01:59

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Pellisworth posted:

What's your source for the details, specifically that he had already brandished a knife prior to the cops coming? I'm genuinely curious.

When initial reports came in several witnesses confirmed that he was being irrational, and had a knife. I think its safe to assume that info was in the dispatch call.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 02:02

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Mr. Glass posted:

I completely agree, i just think it's disingenuous to say "they can afford" MRAPs when they really couldn't if they had to pay for it themselves.

Agreed. I know that when I said "they" I didn't mean the PD themselves, but more a criticism of the entire system that funds it. I assume others are using "they" the same way.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 02:04

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Neo Duckberg posted:

Where is that nice lady I'm going to go say hi

On the anon stream it looked like she got put into a cop car. Not in cuffs mind you, just politely given a ride.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 02:27

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Koalas March posted:

People on the anon stream saying someone's wife was arrested for starting a for inciting a riot??

FACTS: Older white lady and dude were agitating the crowd with signs in support of Wilson, the cop shooter.
Cops polietly escorted them into a car, no cuffs.

UNSUBSTANTIATED CLAIMS BY MAN ON THE STREET: The 2 people were Wilsons wife and father.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 02:52

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Shady Amish Terror posted:

In most places in the US, it shouldn't even be expected that the use of deadly force is even necessary, and consolidating fire teams (where you can afford to train them more effectively) and separating them from beat cops (who shouldn't need a gun, specifically, at all times), would make sense, if not for the fact that the entire system is hosed up and tons of people would resist that change, including many or most law enforcement agencies themselves.

But no, you see the threat of terrorism is ever present and our heroes must remain ever vigilant and prepared to defend our freedom.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 03:35

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Vahakyla posted:

Yeah, even better that he was removed immediately by a police supervisor who pushed him away.

Well not immediately...
This guy has been a recurring character on these videos. This was probably the 3rd or 4th time someone on camera caught him doing this.

eSporks fucked around with this message at 04:18 on Aug 21, 2014

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 04:16

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Samurai Sanders posted:

I wonder if he was going home at night thinking he was doing the right thing?

Honestly, I wonder what a lot of police in this story go home at night thinking. Maybe I am taking the fact that I have a job where I can look at myself in the mirror when I go home for granted.

This is the part I struggle to understand. To anyone on the outside seeing the whole picture its pretty clear these cops are doing some seriously hosed up poo poo.
I see the mind set of the officer going a few different ways.
-Its not me, I am trying to do a good job, these other cops are loving it up
-drat thugs tearing poo poo up, they deserve it
-I wish I didn't have to do this, but they are making me keep the peace
-I wish I didn't have to do this, but I have a family to feed

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 04:21

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Pohl posted:

I used to go to a bar and I would drink with a cop and his wife every night. We were all incredibly drunk, and he would drive home 15 miles every single loving night. I offered them a place to stay on more than one occasion, but no, he was fine. This went on for almost a year, before I couldn't I couldn't take his poo poo anymore and I changed bars. I will never get over how superior he was to everyone else, and I will never forget how he drove drunk 7 days a week when I walked home a block or two.

I get what you are saying, but cops do run the spectrum. I've met some dick ones, and I've met some really cool ones. I feel that the system itself is unjust, but that doesn't mean its fair to judge them all equally.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 04:32

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

SinistralRifleman posted:

complying with whatever orders they give you. Even if an arrest is unlawful

Yea dude, just do what you are told. No questions asked. The nice guys in processing will make sure things are handled properly.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 06:24

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

SinistralRifleman posted:

The alternative is getting tasered, maced, batoned or shot on the scene? This is pragmatic advice, not something I necessarily agree with,

The alternative is getting tasered, maced, batoned, or worse in jail when you ask about your miranda rights or what you are charged with.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2014 06:37

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

amuayse posted:

I'm getting conflicted witness reports via google search with some saying he bumrushed the cop, others saying he was running away. I am certain he was shot in the front though, according to the autopsy reports.

The bumrushing the cop is from an anonymous caller to a radio station, but she isn't even an eye witness, she is supposedly getting her info from the wife of Wilson.

So in other words, a 3rd person retelling of Wilsons story is being used to backup Wilsons story.

# ¿ Aug 22, 2014 13:34

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

murphyslaw posted:

Like, the whole 'Brown bullrushed Wilson, he had to shoot him!!' narrative comes from Wilson's wife, who (iirc) told it to another person who then called it in, and this caller was used as a reliable source for a while.

This is so ridiculous to me. I don't understand how Wilson has become his own corroborating witness.

# ¿ Aug 23, 2014 00:46

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

There is some odd logic behind donating to officer wilson.
By making a donation you are admitting that more legal funds increases the chances of that party winning. All the donators claim this is about justice, and a fair trial, yet they are donating to the side that has more money. By their own admission they are skewing the results of the trial even further, creating even less of a chance of justice or a fair trial being the outcome.

Why did I bother trying to apply logic to racism.

# ¿ Aug 23, 2014 02:34

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

OwlBot 2000 posted:

Did anyone see what happened with "Iyanla Vanzant"?

No, why don't you tell us.

# ¿ Aug 23, 2014 04:24

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Wait you guys are arguing about an unsourced quote that says this:

quote:

0.0%

Which is more likely, in a 5 year span less than 100 white people committed sexual assault against black people, or that those stats are all completely made up?

EDIT Found the actual article, not going to bother fact checking it because its source is a giant gently caress off list of all crimes committed in a years span.

eSporks fucked around with this message at 04:55 on Aug 23, 2014

# ¿ Aug 23, 2014 04:51

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

To give them some credit they aren't using microwave rays that make peoples skin burn because they cost too much to use.

# ¿ Aug 23, 2014 04:57

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Damiya posted:

Nick Valencia @CNNValencia
Supporters for Officer Darren Wilson line a sidewalk in St. Louis. #Ferguson #FergusonShooting #CNN

First thing I see in this is this middle. "I don't support race, I support the truth. What a great message I thought. You aren't choosing sides because of racial biased you just want the ... OH then I saw the context.

# ¿ Aug 23, 2014 20:33

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Good Citizen posted:

Here's the video I mentioned. Obviously don't watch it if you don't want to see a mentally ill homeless man shot to death:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwytoxMuk4U

The thing I really don't get about this video us that the guy right next to the murderer is holding a barbie shotgun, but for some reason that wasn't an option.

# ¿ Aug 23, 2014 20:37

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Berk Berkly posted:

And how many bullets did Wilson fire in total?

What does the incident report say about this part? Go on, I'll wait.

According to the incident report he fired 0 shots.

# ¿ Aug 24, 2014 10:19

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Vahakyla posted:

We should not have a black and white view in a situation where the very same action can be either criminal or actually required, depending on the circumstances.

Agreed, but this is very complicated problem. Its nearly impossible (especially in this day and age) for a law or restriction to not be black or white. They are supposed to be clear cut guilty, or not guilty, without stipulations or over ruling circumstances, unless those conditions are written in. Then you run into the problem of having to write in every single possible scenario. Once you have all of that, you run into the issue of what do you while during the time when you are still determining what conditions were met.

# ¿ Aug 26, 2014 01:55

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Yes, its a bit of a shame the media only cared about the police militarization, but at least it got national attention and started a dialogue about Brown and institutional racism.

My Facebook feed has a lot more police shootings and discussion about racism than usual, so I guess the impact of Ferguson is still having an effect.

# ¿ Aug 28, 2014 14:32

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Jai Guru Dave posted:

I'm seeing a non-trivial amount of "Where's the outrage over [superficially similar case] where an unarmed white guy was shot?", the implication being "only black people riot." So I wanted to thank this thread for the convenient Joe Paterno riot stills.

But MAN, people want to change the subject on this something fierce.

Its funny because if every single one of these the PD is really open about the investigation and it appears as though the cops are going on trial. The white victims are also portrayed as kind individuals and the media is getting kind stories from family members.

# ¿ Aug 28, 2014 16:45

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Samurai Sanders posted:

One thing that surprised me is that all the upvoted comments on BBC articles about this issue are pro-police. Does the UK have as many pro-police people as the US does? Or are they all Americans commenting?

I know a lot of Americans, like myself, follow BBC news because it does a better job of covering events in America than american news does. So its probably just American shitheads commenting.

# ¿ Aug 29, 2014 04:35

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Can anyone give me a quick synopsis of how the bringing of charges works in this case? Someone was telling me that the state prosecutor being racists doesn't matter because anyone is able to bring charges forward against Wilson.

# ¿ Aug 29, 2014 13:07

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Vahakyla posted:

You need jurisdiction to charge people.

This person was saying something to the effect that anyone, like Brown's lawyer for example, could present their case to the grand jury and then the grand jury would press charges.

# ¿ Aug 29, 2014 13:32

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

Holy poo poo, that fingerprinting is the textbook example of "wrong place wrong time". You could argue the benefits or intentions all day long but that would be ignoring how utterly stupid the idea was in the first place in this particular incident.

# ¿ Sep 8, 2014 04:33

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# ¿ May 17, 2024 06:11

eSporks: Jun 10, 2011

twodot posted:

where a cop can search your car/body without your consent.

You should just stop posting, your ignorance is showing.

# ¿ Sep 16, 2014 01:54

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Michael Brown Shooting: No probable cause exists to file any charges

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