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Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

namesake posted:

I think the 'well we tried literally everything and Brexit still happened' is a fairly sound strategy but this somehow means letting it through while also standing in the way, there's no sound reasoning and just seems more like a panic move.

I don't understand you at all. Labour could not claim they had tried everything if they didn't take an opportunity to stop May's deal, which this is. It could take no deal Brexit off the table and gives us a chance to not Brexit at all. For an opposition party that's a massive achievement.

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Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Coohoolin posted:

is that what getting old feels like? is this what boomers feel?

Absolutely not, I think. I'm early Gen X and computers weren't really a thing in my university days, let alone the Internet. We wrote our essays by hand. To me the whole fuss about plagiarism seems like a recent development, driven by the need to grade people and infected by property rights nonsense.

E: If someone copied my essays verbatim, I'd have been immensely pleased and flattered, as long as it didn't threaten my marks.

Oh dear me fucked around with this message at 06:55 on Mar 6, 2019

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

BoneMonkey posted:

The problem isn't that they are stealing your work, though that is lovely. But that they are not doing the work for themselves.

Ah, ok. Infected by work ethic crap, then.

qkkl posted:

It's not that plagiarism is a new problem, it's just that the concept that students need to do their own work is outdated with the rise of instant answers at the press of a button.

Partly. But I did my whole degree without once being asked to write a proper citation. If it was a problem, it wasn't one many people cared about.

Oh dear me fucked around with this message at 08:44 on Mar 6, 2019

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Vlex posted:

If someone doesn't process learning material, they don't gain familiarity with it, which means they don't evaluate it

Someone who simply copied every essay would not have learned much at university, but then they would probably have flunked their final exams. Occasional plagiarism would hardly have that problem, unless you're going to insist on some ideal number of essays per annum.

Critical thinking skills can also be developed in activities other than submitting work for grades, believe it or not.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Vlex posted:

So it doesn't matter if people don't do the work, as long as they...do the...work? :psyduck:

It matters for someone's grades if they do no work at all, whether they plagiarize or not. This does not make plagiarism bad in itself. A a plagiarist may have sufficient critical skills already, plus an ability to prioritise their time effectively.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Vlex posted:

The #1 way to reliably and systematically assess whether a cohort possesses a given skill or understanding of a topic is a standardised test of knowledge and/or ability.

You're not arguing with anything anyone has said now, I think. Horror of plagiarism is indeed driven by the need to grade people (and grew as coursework took over from exams).

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Comrade Fakename posted:

I killed a fellow mammal, it was not pleasant, I do not recommend the experience, 2/5.

Commiserations Comrade.

I'm afraid that if you have seen one mouse, you have many, many mice. I used to try humanely trapping them and taking them far away, but I'm not sure how actually humane that is in the end. If you can find how they're getting in (and where in your belongings they are nesting and chewing) you may save yourself much grief.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal
I need some drug addiction advice (for a friend, honest). They've been taking methadone for a long time and are considering going to the GP and trying a) to get it legally and b) to get help to stop. But this would have serious implications for their employment and they live in a Universal Credit area. Does this sound like a good or terrible idea? Where can one get good, confidential advice about such things?

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Azza Bamboo posted:

I don't see how word would travel from the healthcare provider to the place of employment without a breach of confidence.

I think it's a driving issue, they'd lose their licence.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Guavanaut posted:

Current DVLA advice is:

That's a little bit hopeful, thank you, although I suspect they would take the licence. I'll drag my friend to a CAB - we were afraid they had a legal duty to grass, too.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Sex Robot posted:

TCC would probably be best equipped to tell you, they won't believe you when you say it's not you though.

From googling I gather that is a church thing? I'm afraid that's a no go, but thank you.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

jabby posted:

Losing your job sucks and with the current government could even threaten your life. But driving on drugs threatens the lives of people who have absolutely nothing to do with his drug problem. Get him off the road before you end up being responsible for what happens too.

Thanks for this. To be fair I think he is quite reconciled to losing the licence and going on benefits, but the last time he did that was under a much more forgiving regime. I'm the one worrying about UC as I will have to help him apply for it, and I have no idea how to get a drug addict through the Work Capability Test.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal
Efb

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

V. Illych L. posted:

because it doesn't cost anything

We'd have failed to prepare for the elections, making our then staying in rather difficult. It makes sense for them to insist A50 revocation is done by then or not at all. (Unless we agreed to prepare for elections, which May apparently won't do.)

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

V. Illych L. posted:

i trust david attenborough with my life and my very soul, actually

He attended Thatcher's funeral, apparently not to piss.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

JFairfax posted:

isn't the UK like 90% green space?

Being green doesn't mean it's not massively ecologically impoverished.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Jedit posted:

May's deal modified for a customs union would not be the worst thing.

If the vote is on May + customs is it even a possible thing? The EU won't reopen negotiations on the deal, so it could be an easy way for her to say I tried, but those nasty Europeans won't let us.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal
My dad was very left wing and very environmentalist. I don't remember him indoctrinating us - my mother couldn't stand arguments and didn't like politics even being mentioned. But she was an Anglican so we were exposed to many sermons about loving our neighbours. Anyway, my sisters and I all turned out very left and very green, so it must have been the family atmosphere rather than particular events.

But in my youth I was also inclined to pacifism, which I did not get from Dad. I realize now it was a species of liberalism and excessive confidence in the power of rational argument. Years of mounting rage, chiefly at the inaction on climate change and trashing of the environment, plus campaigning for Labour for years and then getting loving Blairites instead, probably cured me of that. Although reading William Morris's Signs of Change also gave me a light bulb moment when he said "of course the fuckers won't give up their stuff peacefully" (or words to that effect).

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Total Meatlove posted:

I support the rights of all peoples to self determination

I just don't see how this 'right' isn't nonsensical. I mean why does it apply to "Scottish people", for example, and not "Cambridge", or "my book club"?

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Azza Bamboo posted:

The two options that have ever been discussed are the Alternate Vote, which is a Single Transferrable Vote, or...

AV is not PR at all. AV Plus, which is AV modified to make it actually proportional, was recommended by the Jenkins commission in 1998. There are also list systems like AMS (which makes it important to control list creation).

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Azza Bamboo posted:

I'm not suggesting that AV is PR. I'm saying it's the only voting reform that has been discussed. While it isn't direct PR I do like it.

And I'm saying that others have been discussed, there was a commission and everything, not all that long ago. The referendum was on AV because that was the only alternative to FPTP Tories would countenance and Clegg was a moron; it was never really wanted by anyone, because it is poo poo.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Aramoro posted:

FPTP is your best chance of full gay space communism. Any form of PR system is just going to compromise your vision.

There is compromise under FPTP, but it happens within parties rather than between them. And as no party can afford to seem divided, it happens in secret, without members even being aware half the time (let alone the public).

It's not much use having a populace that votes Labour if they end up electing Blair and Obamas. PR would at least give the left more clout in the compromise negotiations.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal
I don't really get that last amendment. Haven't the EU said they'll say no unless we make a serious proposal? Telling the govt just to ask again gives them a way to no deal, if so.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Jedit posted:

They will allow a long extension - at least nine months, probably 21, and rumour has it as long as four years. However, we must elect MEPs for that period

But the amendment doesn't say "agree to elections and ask for extension" - that's what worries me. Telling May just to ask for things could go horribly wrong.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Dead Goon posted:

He's still reeling from being owned on Tudor Parliamentary history.

What happened?

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Azza Bamboo posted:

This will inevitably disenfranchise some people, but who?

People who don't drive or get utility bills. Young people, homeless people, lots of renters.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Reveilled posted:

The agreement between the DUP and Conservatives was a confidence and supply arrangement, which was also specifically ruled out by Corbyn.

While I personally would like the Labour Party to consider electoral pacts, I'm not sure what any other arrangement really offers Labour. Can the SNP really afford to vote against leftwing policies?

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

marktheando posted:

I don't think anyone was blaming the vast majority of ordinary English people?

No, they were implying that English people don't suffer it though, which lots of them do. There is definitely accent/dialect privilege, it's just not 'English' privilege.

Oh dear me fucked around with this message at 18:48 on Mar 28, 2019

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

marktheando posted:

Different types of privilege intersect!

Fully aware mate, but you do still have to show that each thing is a type of privilege. White privilege is something all white people enjoy even though it doesn't mean they're not oppressed in other ways; English privilege would be something all English people enjoy even though they're oppressed in other ways. I'm not saying that doesn't exist. I am saying that accent/dialect privilege isn't it.

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Azza Bamboo posted:

I was wondering if I could get an informed opinion of Clause 4 from some OG Labour supporters ITT? I hear a lot from a group of people who want the original Clause 4 to be reinstated, but wonder if this is A: Important B: Something that could cause instability in the party.

I left the party when Blair changed it, and dislike the new version as meaningless piety, but fighting over a sentence is a pointless waste of time. What matters is that we should try to get the message of anticapitalism across to people, to explain to them why capitalism is bad. We can probably do that in better ways than restoring a sacred text.

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Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal
I already use my post office for bank transactions, because all the bank branches have closed. This would just mean that the money got to my account faster.

Well, perhaps I also might not have to trek across the county for anything more complicated, and my savings could be put to better use by the PO than by the banks.

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